Will this nucleus ever win and what the future holds?

[kramnoj]

I don't hate Hardy, but he is the first guy that I would let go among the current stars on this team once he becomes more expensive. I can see him on this team for another year or two beyond this year. Beyond that, I woud prefer Escobar and have Hardy's money to spend on another need.

[twobrewers]

I am surprised by how many are upset with our position players. Hardy, Hall and Weeks are all slumping right now. But I have no doubt that our offense is potent enough to win.

 

Now, if you want to argue about pitching staffs - you have a point. In my opinion, you need two #1 pitchers to be a real playoff threat. Sheets and Yovanni would have been great. But Sheets and Suppan are not going to carry a team in October.

 

I do agree that Weeks and Hardy are definately going to be talked about this offseason. Weeks has never lived up to his potential. Hardy is already in arbitration and the Brewers haven't even discussed a long term deal. They could certainly be moved. The only problem is our best two prospects play OF/3B/1B.

 

Think Bill Hall will switch positions again?

 

p.s. Escobar does have 6 errors already in Huntsville.

[Thurston Fluff]

This core is the first wave of what should be a steady stream of viable major league players for years to come. The problem most of us have is we went through an era where so few prosepcts panned out that we now worry no more are coming after this bunch. The way the Brewers have drafted post Sal Bando makes me feel like this team can continue to upgrade the team without firesales. The core so to speak will change as we find which ones pan out and which don't. If Hardy doesn't produce this season Escobar will be a capable replacement next year and so on. We trade Hardy plug in Escobar and move on. The players we get back from Hardy get plugged in as well. WE don't need this core to be the magical one that wins everything and when it's gone the team will go back to another 15 year slumber. This group is the first of a long line of players that eventually will put it all together and win it all. That was what was sold to us after the Bando era anyway.

[BrewCrewForever]

I think the OF can work with Braun in left, LaPorta in right, and Corey in center, and would certainly be the most ideal for the lineup.

 

I totally agree with that Peavey.

[JohnBriggs12]

Corey Hart has one, count em, one HR in 116 AB's. He has to produce more power than that. I'm also not convinced he can play CF. So with LaPorta coming, and the need to possibly move Gamel to a corner OF spot, I would certainly not view Hart as untouchable.

[Tbadder]

I'm really getting sick of the unwarranted criticism that some people come under here. This is suppose to be an open forum for people who love and think about this game. It's not a hierarchy where people get to tell others what they are thinking or feeling. What? Some of us have access to another person's mind and so we can assume they are having an emotional reaction to some stimulus--that is not only unfair but too often incorrect.

 

The question asked was legitimate, and one that can be asked at any time during the development of a core group of players. When that core changes for any time (like the Gallardo injury) the question will arise more naturally I suppose. But in any case when performance on the field changes the answer to the question changes, the percentages change if you will--hence, it is a legitimate question again and continuously.

 

And any organization worth its salt must balance a long term and a short term plan. In addition, each of these are usually somewhat fluid given the propensity of the world to change. Another reason why this is a legitimate question to ask.

 

The Brewers have three players who are coming to the major leagues in the near future and look to be pretty good players. Of course decisions will have to be made and if some of us here would like to speculate, conjecture, and even dare to make suggestions, what is the big deal? If you can't do that what are we here for?

 

I'd suggest were here for the possiblities, not the definitive truth, which is often allusive in this game we love.

[southpaw121505]

I am surprised by how many are upset with our position players. Hardy, Hall and Weeks are all slumping right now. But I have no doubt that our offense is potent enough to win.

 

Now, if you want to argue about pitching staffs - you have a point. In my opinion, you need two #1 pitchers to be a real playoff threat. Sheets and Yovanni would have been great. But Sheets and Suppan are not going to carry a team in October.

I think these two paragraphs are closely related. I don't have a problem with the line-up. I actually expect them to get really hot at some point, and keep us in the race, only to fall short due to a lack of quality starts. So thats my point, no matter how good our line-up is, can we REALLY COMPETE with one good pitcher this year, and then relying on Gallardo as one good pitcher next year. I'd rather trade a few position players and take a potential hit in offense if it adds better pitching. Especially having guys like Escobar and LaPorta being pretty close next year.

[rluzinski]

I don't pretend to follow the minors as closely as many here so I need a little help. Why should I be excited about Alcides Escobar right now? Why does Madtown Bomber say he is "coming and coming quick." He had a sub .300 OBP last year and currently is hitting .258/.297/.358/.655 in AA. Even with great defense, does he really have any chance of making the majors in 2009? Even with great defense, you can't just ignore offense and right now, Escobar projects as a .250/.275/.300 hitter in the majors. He doesn't even turn 22 until December. He's got a ways to go, no?

[Crewin06]

After watching this team lose spectacularly for most of my childhood, and at the begining of one of the most promising seasons since I have been alive you want to know if I think the Brewers should blow the team up and start over by trading one of the most coveted players in the league who will be a Brewer for at least 3 more seasons after this one?

Yeah, why not

I love that August and September Baseball when there is nothing to play for

[TooLiveBrew]

Ah, I guess I just take more faith in guys like Drew Olson, Tom Haudricourt, and Bill James who said on 540 ESPN the exact thing I said.

 

Professional scouts, are they? The concept that Hardy can only hit FB is just not one I see any reason to believe. You don't have the success he's had at the MLB level without being able to hit offspeed stuff. If you want to take a slow start as a sudden sign he's forgotten how to hit, I suppose that's up to you.

 

Keep in mind Haudricourt has preached repeatedly that Capuano now has lost his 'winner-i-ness' that apparently Chris had for certain seasons, but not others. I'd question if Bill James has even seen Hardy bat more than a handful of times. Olson is the one I'd probably put the most stock in out of those 3, but not if he suddenly has a revised 'official scouting report' that's been compiled only during Hardy's slumping start to 2008 -- not a good time to get an accurate take on a hitter (just as scouting him 'definitively' while he's red-hot wouldn't be accurate, either imo).

 

 

Did Melvin's nucleus win a championship at Texas? And I give Melvin credit with Gallardo and Villy. Dave Bush was steal. The fact of the matter is that there really isn't a talent wealth in the minors. And the point of the statement was do you trade to get it or draft for it to help now if you think this nucleus can win now or do you draft for the future.

 

In the wild-card era, I'm not sure how not winning a championship can be taken seriously as a criticism when you consistently got your team to the playoffs. From there, it's basically a crapshoot. Melvin has been good for our organization's SP depth, not bad. He's the main reason we have been able to have a competent pitching staff after losing both Cappy & Gallardo. I don't think you necessarily trade for any SP, but I do agree with your notion that all the draft picks for this June's draft make this season & next an ideal time for such a move/strategy.

 

 

The supporting evidence is only knee jerk if you think that this nucleus can win now. And I am taking it that is your stance.

 

You are correct, sir. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[sbrylski]

I don't pretend to follow the minors as closely as many here so I need a little help. Why should I be excited about Alcides Escobar right now? Why does Madtown Bomber say he is "coming and coming quick." He had a sub .300 OBP last year and currently is hitting .258/.297/.358/.655 in AA. Even with great defense, does he really have any chance of making the majors in 2009? Even with great defense, you can't just ignore offense and right now, Escobar projects as a .250/.275/.300 hitter in the majors. He doesn't even turn 22 until December. He's got a ways to go, no?

2010 at the earliest, IMO, so I agree. As I understand, the scouting report on him is he plays top 5% defense at SS, and has the potential to hit .300 at the big leagues. He never has been much of a walker, so I'd say he's a .300 / .340 / .400 type major leaguer down the road if all goes well. But yes, he has big strides to make offensively before he's ready, and has the time age-wise to do it.