What about dealing Hart for a young 1/2 starter?

[BrewCrewBaseball]

Trading Hart would be a mistake. Hart is the future in CF. We know he can play the position and he has in the past. He has the speed and range, plus he reacts to the ball off the bat as well as I have seen for a guy who hasnt played the position for a extened period of time. Before we signed Cameron that was the speculation going around ST. That Hart would be CF at some point down the road when Laporta came. Laporta was going to move to right and Hart in center.

Plus, offensively Hart will be a .300 hitter or better during his career. He has the power as well. He could be a .300, 20+HR, 100RBI guy every year. Not to mention steal 30 bases a year. Hart, Braun, and Prince are the guys that they will build around for the next 5 + years.... I dont see the Brewers trading Hart unless they get some great players in return.

I would rather trade a mid-level propect and Weeks who hasn't really proved a whole lot in the 4 years he has been in the Bigs....

[docduany]

It must be because I have such an affinity for him, but in no way can I agree with trading Corey Hart. I just love everything the man does. I haven't watched a Brewer run the bases like him ever!! Paul Molitor is my favorite player going away and I can't even remember Pauly flying around like that ( I'm sure if I was 5 years older and the boys had been televised more I could). I'm just smitten with Corey. I think he's got a chance to stick around for a while. Maybe it's because he seems like a Midwest type player? Braun is so in love with Braun that he's destined to play in the big lights before it's all done. Prince has the prince of darkness as his agent. Even though Prince exudes character and other great intangibles, Boras will lead him to the biggest pay day period-- and that just physically can't be Milwaukee. Rickie and J.J. can't seem to step up to that top step. And while Corey is a notch below Prince and Braun is better too, I'd rather explore dealing them for a MAJOR blockbuster type before dealing Corey.

[twobrewers]

Before we signed Cameron that was the speculation going around ST. That Hart would be CF at some point down the road when Laporta came. Laporta was going to move to right and Hart in center.

I haven't heard anyone from the Brewers mention that. In fact, I think Gwynn, Kapler and Gross all playing CF during the Cameron suspension without Corey Hart playing CF once speaks volumes.

 

Corey probably could play CF. But the Brewers haven't really done much to move in that direction.

[hauser42]

Yost stated the reason the Hart was playing right when Cameron was out was so that they did not have him moving around. Team wanted guys to be comfortable in there spots and also in the hitting order while Mike was out on suspension.

[brettac1]

I haven't heard anyone from the Brewers mention that. In fact, I think Gwynn, Kapler and Gross all playing CF during the Cameron suspension without Corey Hart playing CF once speaks volumes.

 

Actually, I think Melvin or Ash mentioned this at one of those winter warm up things. I think that it's the way to go, and that Cameron's option just gets declined after this season if the team feels comfortable with LaPorta being ready.

 

I sure as heck don't want a slap-hitter like Gywnn or The Tropical Depression playing CF everyday.

[Postseason2006]

Trade Fielder now? You guys are a riot! Which LH bat takes his place? Branyan...tooooo funny!

[BrewCrewBaseball]

I haven't heard anyone from the Brewers mention that. In fact, I think Gwynn, Kapler and Gross all playing CF during the Cameron suspension without Corey Hart playing CF once speaks volumes.

 

Actually, I think Melvin or Ash mentioned this at one of those winter warm up things. I think that it's the way to go, and that Cameron's option just gets declined after this season if the team feels comfortable with LaPorta being ready.

 

I sure as heck don't want a slap-hitter like Gywnn or The Tropical Depression playing CF everyday.

 

That's where I remember hearing it as well. Plus it was mentioned last year when Hart played CF a couple times last season. I think he would be great. He has the talent to play anywhere out there..

[KCBrewerfan34]

Hart & Gamel FOR Lincecum, sign me up in a Milwaukee minute. I'm sorry its very very difficult to acquire pitching, Of'ers are easier to find. Cameron's option could be picked up and LaPorta is in right. Lincecum replaces Sheets next year, or if by some small chance BS re-signs

 

Sheets

Gallardo

Lincecum

Suppan

5th starter

 

WOW!!!!!

[Gopher74]

No way I trade Hart. I'd rather keep Hart and trade Prince for a young stud pitcher, then put LaPorta at 1B.

 

I agree, I suspect Cameron is a stopgap for Hart in CF. Prince is very replaceable at 1b, Hart isn't in CF.

 

If Hart can play CF, I think he has more value than Prince.

And I totally agree with that, however, the fact is I don't see the team being willing to move Prince for a myriad of reasons right now, not the least of which is just a simple public relations standpoint. IN two years you can say we're dealing him because he's not likely to stay and because he's going to cost a lot of money and you can get a lot for him. Right now trading your most recognizable player because of a guy who frankly most fans haven't heard of is able to replace him would be a public relations nightmare.

 

So while I agree that it's the better way to go, it's also unlikely in my opinion. Then again, so is dealing Hart.

 

[Never Outhustled]

Nobody has hit like LaPorta because top hitting prospects aren't in the Southern League at 23.

Ryan Howard played his AA ball when he was 24. He turned out OK. Its Laporta's 1st time seeing AA caliber pitching, and he's killing it. Thats all that really matters.

[Gopher74]

Hart & Gamel FOR Lincecum, sign me up in a Milwaukee minute. I'm sorry its very very difficult to acquire pitching, Of'ers are easier to find. Cameron's option could be picked up and LaPorta is in right. Lincecum replaces Sheets next year, or if by some small chance BS re-signs

Well, I never suggested that we trade both Corey Hart AND Mat Gamel for Matt Lincecum. In fact, my entire logic was predicated on the fact that if we traded Hart, we'd only have to trade Hart. Dealing Mat Gamel as well kinda defeats half of the upside to us, which was that Mat Gamel and Matt LaPorta could likely be counted on at least in the near future to produce consistently on the big league level to make up for the loss of Hart. And Gamel being a left hander in a right handed dominated system is even more reason to not want to deal him. Plus, that's simply too much to give up for a pitcher, even one as good as Lincecum is, with his injury concerns.

 

-Now, for those who are saying that Corey Hart's great, and he's a big part of our future, of course. But that's why you trade him. I'd be much happier dealing a guy like Mike Rivera, but nobody wants him. Taking personal feelings for a player and throwing them away, at least with Hart you have someone who could replace him right now. Maybe not play as well as he does, but someone who can do a good job, and you're getting another frontline starter. So it's about giving to get. You have to give up an awful lot.

 

I see no reason any of those players is anything more than a half month injury call up next year.

 

I guess I just don't see what Matt LaPorta spefically and to a lesser degree(because of defensive position) that Mat Gamel has to prove in the minors? Especially with the stick to the point where they need another almost two full years down there. I truly think that's overkill. It'd be nice to leave them down for that long because then they'd matchup better with the departures, but still, I think at the absolute latest, LaPorta's ready this Sept, and Gamel with the stick by the start of next year.

 

Escobar with the glove was ready about 5 years ago, but I'm still hoping that he gets a bit thicker and develops into a Yunel Escobar type player. Someone who can hit about 45 doubles a year to go with 13-16 HR's with about a .300/.335 type line. I think he's got a really bright future, but is still a bit raw.

 

If we are talking Fielder, I would want both Cain and Lincecum (we'd probably have to add another player, but nothing too valuable). Then move LaPorta to 1B (which I'll admit might be a bit rocky at first).

 

Well, that's even a bit much. Even if you could get those two for Prince and a prospect not named Matt(or Mat) or Alcides, that'd likely be too good to pass up, but ultimately not really realistic.

 

Fielder is not coming back...he just isn't. Scott Boras will not let him, not when he could be a DH in Anaheim, Boston, or New York making $18 million a year.

First of all, if it's for "just" 18 million that he wants, my guess is that he will be back. Even if it's in that 20-22 million dollar range, I think the Brewers re-sign him. Mark A has already said that the Brewers "will" re-sign him, essentially making a guarantee. I don't think it's a good idea given the replacements that we've got waiting, but I simply do not understand how people can make such absolute statements about his eventual departure. I mean, "he just isn't" when he's 4 years away from being a FA because of his agent? There is just no way you can say that. And again, the price tag you've given him, the Brewers would almost certainly match...even if they shouldn't.

[Postseason2006]

Who is the Matt Linecum some of you mention? I would deal for Tim Linecum but Matt?????

[Big Reed]

Tim allows his friends to call him Matt. it's kind of a in family nickname. kind of like when people call me Reed. My real name is Ned, but I post as Reed on internet forums.. I used to be a catcher in the big leagues before this new job was offered to me.

[logan82]

Gopher74 wrote:

I see no reason any of those players is anything more than a half month injury call up next year.

 

I guess I just don't see what Matt LaPorta spefically and to a lesser degree(because of defensive position) that Mat Gamel has to prove in the minors? Especially with the stick to the point where they need another almost two full years down there. I truly think that's overkill. It'd be nice to leave them down for that long because then they'd matchup better with the departures, but still, I think at the absolute latest, LaPorta's ready this Sept, and Gamel with the stick by the start of next year.

In the next sentence I go on to basically say we have no room for them in the majors right now. I don't think they need all of next year to develope in the minors offensivley, but there isn't any room for them right now and it wouldn't be the end of the world if we left young MLB ready talent in the minors an extra year. All of our young position players except for Prince and Hart would have benifited from another year in the minors. Paying Cameron for next year and gaining a year of LaPorta in 2015 wouldn't be bad. Leaving them in the minors to get better defensivly wouldn't be bad either.

[Gopher74]

Who is the Matt Linecum some of you mention? I would deal for Tim Linecum but Matt?????

Tim Lincecum's not any good. Matt Lincecum is his younger brother who's going to be a REAL stud. My thoughts are that we trade for the draft rights to the number 1 pick and draft him, and install him instantly as our ace.

 

In the next sentence I go on to basically say we have no room for them in the majors right now. I don't think they need all of next year to develope in the minors offensivley, but there isn't any room for them right now and it wouldn't be the end of the world if we left young MLB ready talent in the minors an extra year.

Well, first of all, while I was quoting you, it was more a general question to others who have echoed the same sentiments. Several others on this thread as well as others have said that they'd like to see LaPorta and Gamel(moreso LaPorta) stay in the minors through 09.

 

As for you in particular, I was kinda operating under the assumption that we'd have traded Corey Hart or opened up room.

 

But I do agree, if we don't make any moves, I'd like to see us bring Cameron back, and I'd also like to see both stay in the minors save for a callup for interleague games through next season just because it'd mean that we don't need them, and because it'd mean we'd have possession of them longer. So in that sense, I do agree with you and should have read a little closer.

 

But at the same time, I'm still curious why others want to see them stay down in the minors because they think they need the time to develop.

 

 

[logan82]

Gopher74 wrote:

But at the same time, I'm still curious why others want to see them stay down in the minors because they think they need the time to develop.

I am guessing that most people think that both are sub-par defenders and in Gamel's case might have to change positions. I personally leave them down and pick up Cameron's option because I would rather see one of those guys come up rather than a Barnwell caliber player and I don't think it would hurt either to improve their defense. Operating under the assumption we traded Hart I definitely pick up Cameron's option because I don't want a rookie and Gwynn in the outfield. I don't want Gwynn as a starter in any case.

 

I was just checking because it looked like I was quoted out of context.http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[DrWood]

Where is the justification that LaPorta is a significantly limited defensive player? He's not making errors, he is taking good routes to balls (if not particularly speedy routes), and by all reports has acclimated to the OF.

If Braun was injured, I believe LaPorta would be called up.

[B2k1121]

This brings absolutely nothing to the table in this discussion but I traded Corey Hart and Jeff Suppan for Tim Lincecum in MLB 2k8 and immediately moved Laporta to Milwaukee.

 

Would anyone want the Brewers to do this is real life?

 

Edit:

I just read the rest of the thread and you guys pretty much already discussed it.

[Tbadder]

While I believe this type of trade must be made, it is much too soon to make said trade. Each player needs an entire year at AA and possibly a third to half season in AAA.

 

I've said this before but the Brewers should identify Hardy, Hall, and Hart as tradeables because of the presence of LaPorta, Gamel, and Escobar.

 

Here's the short term problems with this scenario. LaPorta is a leftfielder, so Braun might have to be moved to rightfield. I don't see this as a real problem as Braun has the range and arm for rightfield.

 

Problem two: Escobar is no gaurantee as an offensive player; however, I believe he'll develop into a good doubles hitter if we're patient. I think he may actually have a growth spurt or two still on the horizon.

 

Problem three: Gamel is a huge defensive liability, so we'll have to be doubly patient with him.

 

I don't think guys like Lincecum can be had in a trade. The Young/Garza trade is the anamoly, not the norm. So I think we're more likely to go after a Cain-type. The Lincecums of the world are to be had in free agency only, which doesn't really make Milwaukee a player.

 

So the question might be. Can we get Hall for Cain? I assume we could get Hart for Cain, but I could also be way off base.

[logan82]

DrWood[/b]]Where is the justification that LaPorta is a significantly limited defensive player? He's not making errors, he is taking good routes to balls (if not particularly speedy routes), and by all reports has acclimated to the OF.

If Braun was injured, I believe LaPorta would be called up.

If I had to guess I would guess that LaPorta is limited in the way Carlos Lee is limited as an outfielder. Lee doesn't make mistakes in the field either, but would never be confused with a good defender.

[Tbadder]

The more and more I read about LaPorta, and listen to people like Colby, the more I think LaPorta will be an average major league leftfielder.

[Invader3K]

I really don't think LaPorta is likely ready for MLB before the end of this year. Do we have to keep waiting for the next AAA guy to help us win?

[eanelson4]

I think that Corey Hart is a very undervalued guy not just on the Brewers, but in all of MLB. I would hate to trade him away, knowing that he is one of the guys we might actually have a chance to keep in the upcoming years. Is LaPorta a big strikeout / HR guy? If so, I would rather trade him than Hart because we have enough of them already.

[Gopher74]

.

Here's the short term problems with this scenario. LaPorta is a leftfielder, so Braun might have to be moved to rightfield. I don't see this as a real problem as Braun has the range and arm for rightfield.

Well, LaPorta's been playing Right Field. In fact, that's almost all he's played. Clearly they want him to be a right fielder in the future. Frankly, I could see Braun as a possible CF'er in the future. Not this year, but he has the athletic ability to play there in the future. I don't think it's impossible that in the long term, you could see Gamel, Braun and LaPorta in the OF rather than Hart as everyone seems to assume. I'll concede that most will not like this idea, but I'm just throwing it out there. Of course Braun would need to prove he's got the ability to get to enough balls, but if Hart is seen as a potential CF'er, why not Braun? He's got the physical tools.

Each player needs an entire year at AA and possibly a third to half season in AAA.

 

Why? Based on what? What exactly suggests those two need that much time in the minors? That would still have Braun in AAA right now. Not every player needs to take the same route to the big leagues.

 

I don't think guys like Lincecum can be had in a trade.

Why? He was shopped around this past off-season. He could have been had for Rios which tells me that he could be had for Corey Hart, if not Corey Hart plus a minor leaguer.

 

So the question might be. Can we get Hall for Cain? I assume we could get Hart for Cain, but I could also be way off base.

I don't think we could get Cain for Hall. In fact, I'm fairly certain we couldn't. Cain's not far behind Lincecum. He's another frontline starter.

I'd be fine with giving up Hart for Cain plus a prospect and bringing LaPorta up.

[twobrewers]

Frankly, I could see Braun as a possible CF'er in the future. Not this year, but he has the athletic ability to play there in the future. I don't think it's impossible that in the long term, you could see Gamel, Braun and LaPorta in the OF rather than Hart as everyone seems to assume. I'll concede that most will not like this idea, but I'm just throwing it out there. Of course Braun would need to prove he's got the ability to get to enough balls, but if Hart is seen as a potential CF'er, why not Braun? He's got the physical tools.

Exactly. No one talks much about it, however. Everyone projects Corey Hart as the CF of the future. But we can always keep Cameron for next year. (We hold an option) And Braun is very athletic. Given time, he could very well develop into a CF.

And no way could we get Cain for Hall. The Giants need younger talent that they would control for many years. Hall doesn't fit that description as well as Hart.