At what point do the Brewers pony up and make a deal for Ian Stewart?

[paulmolitor4]

To me this move just makes sense. Stewart is blocked by Atkins, and is a LH bat, which is what the Brewers need. I know Hall is a good guy and well-liked, but I feel this would be a good move for the present and the future. I think Stewart would fit in nicely in the six hole behind Hart. Question is: What would it take to get Stewart?

[ILuvDaBush]

Atkins is the heir apparent to Todd Helton, when he retires, which should coincide with a full-time job for Ian Stewart. I don't see them moving Stewart in the near future.

[piccione88]

It is way too early to say that Hall needs to moved, he has shown great power this year as well. Last year was a down year, but alot of people would argue that it was largley due to bad luck, and getting injured when he showed some signs of life. Either way Stewart is not an obvious upgrade in my eyes.

 

Stewart makes good contact, and has a decent eye at the plate, but he has not shown great power yet. Last season with the Colorado Springs he hit a line of .309/.379/.478 which looks impressive until you consider the park he played in. Colorado Springs plays there home games at an elevation of over 6,500 feet which is the highest of any pro baseball team, 1,000 feet higher than the Rockies play at, and the Sky Sox do not have a humidor to my knowledge.

 

With that elevation Stewart's .169 isolated power does not look to impressive. Stewart makes good contact, and has a decent eye at the plate. His power has not come around, and plays poor defense. His power should come around at some point, but as of right now Billy in my eyes is still the better player.

[paulmolitor4]

I agree Stewart's defense might be a question, but I wouldn't be concerned about a lack of power. Isn't a solid LH contact hitter what the Brewers' lineup needs? And yes Stewart will develop power. He hit 30 HR's in A ball a few years ago, so he must have decent power. I've also heard him compared to Chase Utley as a hitter, although that might be an overly optimistic comparison. Nonetheless the guy has talent, and is 25 years-old, so he doesn't need any further seasoning in the minors. As far as Helton's heir apparent at first, the Rockies also have Joe Koshansky in the minors (a decent LH bat in his own right), so I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that Atkins will move to first. Anyway, regardless of whether or not you would acutally make a deal for Stewart, I was hoping some of you would weigh in on what it might take to get Stewart. I'm guessing Hall and a prospect, but I'm not really sure.

[paul253]

I dont think we have the ammo to get Stewart. Our farm system isnt very strong anymore, and is really weak in pitching, which I am sure what Colorado will be looking for. And if we did manage to get him, I'd rather move Hall to second and get rid of Weeks. I dont see Weeks ever being overly productive.

[endaround]

You must have missed last year then.

 

To get Stweart? Major league pitching. TheRockies are likely either holding him for the future or as a chip to get a top flight starter.

[Gopher74]

I dont think we have the ammo to get Stewart. Our farm system isnt very strong anymore, and is really weak in pitching, which I am sure what Colorado will be looking for. And if we did manage to get him, I'd rather move Hall to second and get rid of Weeks. I dont see Weeks ever being overly productive.

Our farm system still has plenty of tradeable pieces.

 

I'd argue that it's got more movable pieces than it did 2-3 years ago. At what point would we have ever considered moving our top prospect in the past? Now Matt LaPorta, a legit top 20 prospect would take a lot to get, but still most certainly can be had for the right deal...a statement that I suppose is always true, but that "deal" isn't going to be require as much as it would have in the past.

 

Also, I don't know what "overly productive" equates to, but what I do know is that Rickie Weeks was one of the top 5 leadoff hitters in baseball last year in a number of statistical area's. That's pretty productive to me for a guy who was banged up most of the year.

 

Rickie's problem is confidence. He's the sort of player who presses when he's scuffling a little bit. I'm sure this will illicit a disagreement, but for a player like him, I just see him as getting a hit early in a game, or having a 3 hit game, and then following the next AB/Game as though he's almost earned a little bit of capital in his mind, and he's a lot looser up at the plate, not putting so much pressure on himself to succeed. Again, this is what my opinion of Weeks is, I don't actually know that any better than anyone else, I just know that when I played, that's kinda how I felt, and that's when I'd really go off.

 

And for him, to be able to just go up there and trust his hands and let it all hang out has proven to be a huge plus for him.

 

I believe that he's at worst the 3rd most talented player on this team, and quite possible the most talented. I also think he needs to go after that first pitch a little bit more until pitchers stop grooving him fastballs to get ahead in the count. You've seen what he does when he swings at the first pitch. The leadoff bomb vs the Cubs, the three run triple the other night...when he's aggressive, he's an incredible player. He simply needs to find that happy medium between aggression and patience that hinders so many hitters.

[JohnBriggs12]

I'm not so sure the Brewers don't have the "solid LH contact hitter" already knocking on the door and his nickname is Hurricane. It's still early, but he's raking at AAA, his strikeout rate is way, way down, and he's taking walks too. If he becomes adequate as a CF, I think his stock goes way, way up.

[endaround]

Why? At 2B his value is loads better than at CF. Yes he has a better chance at staring in CF for Milwaukee, but it really does nothing to his actual value.

[princeginterhallhelms04]

I just don't see the Rockies moving him. Billy is playing pretty darn good defense and hitting a little too. I know that we need a three bagger for the future but if Hall can hit .260 and play the defense he is playing it makes this team better.

[DrWood]

we don't need stewart to play 3b in Nashville. we have branyan and dillon and nelson and nunez to do that!

http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[endaround]

I just don't see the Rockies moving him. Billy is playing pretty darn good defense and hitting a little too. I know that we need a three bagger for the future but if Hall can hit .260 and play the defense he is playing it makes this team better.

Hall is under Brewer control until 2011. The future can be a long way off

 

[uwisfan]

if the Brewers need a LH bat, I expect Iribarren and Branyan to get their shots at it. Definitely serviceable options.

[paul253]

You must have missed last year then.

 

Apparently I did. I remember him getting sent down to Nashville because he was hitting below .200. I remember everyone getting all excited when he came back up and hit like .273, although his OBP was pretty good. His power for a leadoff guy is above average, but I think it has more to do with the fact that he's not a typical leadoff hitter. Most leadoff hitters dont hit for power, so his HR's and Slugging are going to be higher. This year he is again hitting below .200. I'm wondering what he has ever done to make people think he will be consistently productive. I can say with absolute honesty I would rather see Irabarren playing 2nd base right now than Weeks.

 

As far as Stewart goes, I'd love to have him, but as was mentioned, Colorado is going to want pitching, which we don't have.

[hauser42]

I agree the that the Brewers dont have what it takes to get Stewart. Not sure the Rockies will move him since Atkins did not except the contract they offered him this off season. Rockies are more likely to move Atkins this off season before they have to start paying him.

[Gobias Industries]

I can say with absolute honesty I would rather see Irabarren playing 2nd base right now than Weeks.

The only things Hernan is better at than Weeks is fielding and making contact. And out of those two, only really fielding is important. Weeks' OBP would crush Hernan's at this level. His OBP is .333 right now while he's yet to get on a hot streak and has generally ran into poor luck so far.

[Gopher74]

You must have missed last year then.

 

Apparently I did. I remember him getting sent down to Nashville because he was hitting below .200. I remember everyone getting all excited when he came back up and hit like .273, although his OBP was pretty good.

It's funny how the only thing that matters for a leadoff hitter is kinda glossed over there. "Although it was pretty good". Yea, "although" he had the best OBP for a leadoff hitter the last couple months, because a stat that really doesn't matter much anymore wasn't great(.273 BA), I'm just going to keep my head in the sand and say he wasn't good last year, and I'll play it off as people overreacting.

 

Hmmm...

 

[paulmolitor4]

Would a trade involving Hall and Bush be able to land Stewart? Hall's OBP is just awful. Yeah, I know he hits HR's, but our lineup is full of those guys. If this last weekend is any indication, this team needs guys that make consistent contact and get on base. I think the current Brewers team will be very prone to cold spells with so many power hitting strikeout guys. The only way the Brewers make it to the playoffs and make noise in the playoffs is if they find themselves in a hot streak at the time. Just too much inconsistency with this current group. Also it will be nice adding Cameron to the mix, but he is also a power hitting strikeout guy.

 

On another note: I also really like the idea of moving LaPorta for Clement. Would continue to improve the team for the immediate future, and really solidify all positions on the team.

[paul253]

It's funny how the only thing that matters for a leadoff hitter is kinda glossed over there. "Although it was pretty good". Yea, "although" he had the best OBP for a leadoff hitter the last couple months, because a stat that really doesn't matter much anymore wasn't great(.273 BA), I'm just going to keep my head in the sand and say he wasn't good last year, and I'll play it off as people overreacting.

Its funny how you gloss over the fact that he was so bad that he had to get sent down to the minors just to get some confidence. Yeah, .374 is a good (23rd in the NL) OBP, but its nice to get a hit every now and then. He also struck out 116 times, which was good for 30th, despite spending time on the DL and in the minors. I just dont understand what he has done to make people think he is capable of consistently being productive. You need to cite more than OBP to convince me. And the reason I'd prefer Irabarren is because his approach seems to be much better. Weeks is always trying to pull the ball, even when he doesnt have to. Putting the ball in play can certainly have its benefits.

[sheetswannabe]

Hall is under Brewer control until 2011. The future can be a long way off

Isnt he only under control until 2010? I thought he signed the 4 year contract before last year?

[And That]

Hall is signed through 2010, with a $9.25 mil team option for 2011. Brewerfan's salary page.

[Gopher74]

 

 

Its funny how you gloss over the fact that he was so bad that he had to get sent down to the minors just to get some confidence.

 

Was that the reason? I thought it was because his swing was off because he was starting his bat too early because of his wrist injury? Huh.....confidence you say? Hadn't heard anyone associated with the team say that.

Yeah, .374 is a good (23rd in the NL) OBP, but its nice to get a hit every now and then.

 

He's a leadoff hitter. How many hitters had a better OBP while in the leadoff spot? Weeks was in the top 5. That's what matters.

He also struck out 116 times, which was good for 30th, despite spending time on the DL and in the minors.

 

So what? I mean, seriously, so what? So his outs weren't as entertaining as if he'd have hit the ball right at someone? Strikeouts are incredibly overrated. I don't care if he strikes out 300 times in 600 PA's if he has a 500 OBP. Of course, some people would still complain about that.

 

The comments about BA and K's REALLY sheds a light as to why you honestly believe that Hernan would be a better option right now at 2nd than Rickie. Great, he may hit .285 with a .300 OBP and not K as much. We could get Johnny Estrada to play 2nd base as well. Doesn't mean he'd be better than Rickie Weeks.

You need to cite more than OBP to convince me.

 

Quite frankly, I'm not all that concerned if you are convinced or not. I mean, OBP is so much more important than any other stat from a leadoff hitter(and saying you need to show me something other than that, is like saying you need to show me something other than ERA to convince me a pitcher is a good pitcher), but again, you can think what you want about Weeks. But when you say that he's never done anything in the big leagues the in April of the year AFTER he was one of the top5 leadoff hitters in the game in SLG, OBP, OPS, HR's..., then I think you're going to get an argument.

Putting the ball in play can certainly have its benefits.

 

Of course. But again, Johnny Estrada put the ball in play all the time. And I honestly don't think you've seen enough of Hernan to make the statement than his approach is better(and if you've followed him around the minors, my apologies).

 

Weeks gets on base. Yes, he needs to improve other area's of his game, but bottom line, he gets on base. That's the only thing that matters with him.

[paul253]

Thats all good and well, but again, tell me what he has actually done to make you think he will be consistently productive. He was in the top 5 in all those categories because he is a completely different hitter than most leadoff hitters. Most leadoff hitters dont concentrate on HRs or RBI's or slugging %. If you put Fielder in the leadoff spot he'll lead in all those areas too, but that doesnt mean you could claim he is a great leadoff hitter because he leads them in HR's, RBI's, Slugging and OBP. The fact is, if Weeks hit anywhere but leadoff his numbers would be well below average, so claiming he is a top five "leadoff" hitter is, in my opinion, a cop out because overall he is not a good hitter and has shown nothing to suggest he ever will be. I realize its not even a month into the season, but a .325 OBP for a leadoff hitter is nothing to brag about. Even his slugging is low this year so far. Maybe he heats up, maybe he doesn't, but you can't blame the wrist anymore. Also, I dont really know where the comparison to Johnny Estrada came from, but Weeks putting the ball in play is a little different than Estradra because Estrada took 10 minutes to get to first, whereas Weeks should be using his speed to beat out hits, like Corey Hart seems to be able to do. No, I haven't seen Irabarren hit much, but I have seen Weeks hit alot Weeks doesn't know how to do anything but swing as hard as he can and try to pull it.

 

Was that the reason? I thought it was because his swing was off because he was starting his bat too early because of his wrist injury? Huh.....confidence you say? Hadn't heard anyone associated with the team say that.

 

Well if thats what you want to say to make it better, thats fine. His wrist was hurt, his swing was off...whatever it was...he was terrible. Has his swing always been off? Does that explain why his highest batting average in a season was a cool .279? He had a good month...one good month...and you seem to think thats good enough to claim that there is nothing to be worried about as far as his hitting ability goes.

[paulmolitor4]

Can you say hijacked? This thread wasn't meant to be about Weeks.

[aracko]

I like Hall at 3rd - and I was not buying into this plan at the start of the season - I wanted Braun to stay and Hall to play Superman again. I dont see what the guy has done to deserve losing his job.