OF Gabe Gross traded to Tampa Bay for minor league pitcher Josh Butler

[endaround]

I'm willing to place a friendly wager that at the end of the year, Gabe Gross has a significantly higher OPS than Tony Gwynn.

 

 

Robert

Not only a higher OPS but a higher OBP as well

 

[Weirdos19]

I'm glad we got something for Gabe. If Gwynn hadn't gotten hurt, we wouldn't be having the walks conversation. Gwynn would've been out there versus all RHP.

 

Both Gwynn and Gross had little playing time, but I thought Gwynn was much more impressive.

 

No options for Gabe, so he had to go.

[JJHardy7]

I don't understand how "he just needs consistent playing time" is a valid argument for Gross's production. The fact is, he was never going to get consistent playing time with the Brewers, so what mattered was how he performed in the role we had available - backup OF and PH. From what I've seen of his stats, he doesn't do well in that role. It will be better for him to go somewhere where he has a chance to start everyday.

 

I think you pretty much summed up your not understanding "he just needs consistent playing time" with your ending statement that it's better for him to start everyday. Saying that he needs to play everyday doesn't mean it should be in Milwaukee. He tore up AAA when he started everyday last year and like I've said before Gabe has said that the more consistent playing time he gets the more likely he is to produce. He's a taller guy and a la Corey Hart struggles a bit when his swing isn't consistent and getting at bats everyday is a great way to do that.

[Gobias Industries]

I was hoping Gwynn would of been healthy to start the season and stayed hot for a little bit so we could have done this kind of deal with him instead of Gabe. I assume this means Gwynn is the longterm answer as the 4th outfielder. That isn't the worst thing in the world considering Chris Magruder filled that role not too long ago.

[valpocrewsader]

Any insight on Josh Butler? Career minor leaguer?

Baseball Prospectus: "A second round pick in 2006, Josh Butler is a big righty with a heavy sinker that generates tons of groundballs." 6' 5", 200 lbs.

 

A move I'm happy about, sacrificing some power/obp for defense/avg/fundamentals/speed is okay by me when we're talking about the 4th/5th outfielder. Especially when the latter still has upside and the rest of the team already has plenty of defensive deficiencies.

 

[don1481]

I think you pretty much summed up your not understanding "he just needs consistent playing time" with your ending statement that it's better for him to start everyday. Saying that he needs to play everyday doesn't mean it should be in Milwaukee. He tore up AAA when he started everyday last year and like I've said before Gabe has said that the more consistent playing time he gets the more likely he is to produce. He's a taller guy and a la Corey Hart struggles a bit when his swing isn't consistent and getting at bats everyday is a great way to do that.

But let's be honest - when Cameron gets back, where was Gross going to get that "consistent playing time?" Odd are, he was not going to. He's not as good as Hart and definitely not as good as Braun. So where would he be for Milwaukee? Getting occasional playing time off the bench. Not a good situation for Gross, especially for those supporters who want him to get "consistent playing time."

[Glennron]

The Brewers now have zero power from LH bench players. If Gwynn or Counsell come up in a late game situation against a RHP down a couple of runs, you have absolutely no hope of a home run. If an OFer goes down for an extended period of time the teams offensive production could drop dramatically. Of course if no one gets hurt it's not a big deal, but I would've still liked it if he was kept on the team. He was probably my second favorite Brewer and I hope he does very well in Tampa with whatever playing time he receives.

[JohnBriggs12]

Gross' numbers were good in 06, but not much since then. The only way he had roster spot was if they kept Gwynn at AAA. For them to do that Gross had to be clearly the better player now and he wasn't. That's not to say he's not a good guy to have or that he didn't contribute or couldn't produce like he did in 06, but more the reality of life as a backup. You get shuffled around.

 

The fact that he's lefthanded really only comes into play if you decide he's going to play at least semi-regularly and considering who he is behind, that's not likely. They have lefthanded PHs to cover that role in Gwynn and Counsell and as we learned a nice emergency option in Iribarren.

 

They did well to get an arm with some upside.

[naivin]

I pretty much echo brettac's comments as well as DougJones's comments on Gross. He was a solid player that the stupid fans started hating because he got off to a 2-20 start while mostly pinch hitting. He gets a week of starts and he starts pounding the ball.

 

Meanwhile Gwynn is loved because he is fast, gritty and a gamer. Oh and because his name is Gwynn.

Just ridiculous comments. Stupid fand started hating him because he got off to a 2-20 start? Apparently you missed last season, and the rest of his rather ho hum career.

 

That whole Gwynn is named Gwynn argument is quite tired as well. Do you think Doug Melvin is keeping him around because his name is Gwynn? You know better than that.

 

If Gross is as good as you guys seem to think he is, he was certainly the wrong guy for the role he was expected to fill here. If he needs to play regularly to produce, this was certainly the wrong place for him. I got news for you, he isn't going to get a week of starts here once Cameron returns, so if he can't play well without regular at bats, how does his presence here help the Brewers? The Brewers need a back-up outfilder...the last guy off the bench, not a guy who needs regular PT to have value.

 

Seems to me the Brewers did him a favor by providing a chance to play every day, and I suspect Doug will say that was part of it, as he obviously had no place in the Brewers plans, so getting something for him makes sense.

[homer]

It boils down to a 4th/5th outfielder traded for a decent prospect. All in all - pretty fair return.

BUT...Gross was left handed and one of the few guys that actually took a walk. He was ideal for that 7th spot in front of the pitcher and actually began hitting well and getting on base when he was moved there. Now I have no idea who they put there - options like Hall or Hardy both swing at junk too often and walk too little. I fear the there might be little production out of that spot the rest of the year.

[naivin]

It's hopefully not going to be a big deal anyway but I don't see how anyone thinks this makes the team better this year.

I don't think I saw anybody say that. Coversely, I don't see how anyone thinks this makes the team worse this year. A week from today, Gabe Gross or Tony Gwynn were going to see thier chances to get in a game fall off very dramatically, so in my eyes the question becomes which guy brings more to that last guy off the bench, bunt a guy over, late inning relacement role, and I don't think there's any question, its Gwynn. Lets just say I won't lose a lot of sleep because we won't have Gabe Gross around as the LH bat to crack that late inning PH home run. If that's really a concern, this team is gonna be in trouble.

[JJHardy7]

But let's be honest - when Cameron gets back, where was Gross going to get that "consistent playing time?" Odd are, he was not going to. He's not as good as Hart and definitely not as good as Braun. So where would he be for Milwaukee? Getting occasional playing time off the bench. Not a good situation for Gross, especially for those supporters who want him to get "consistent playing time."

 

I think you may be missing my point and I'm assuming others points. I put in my post that Milwaukee may not be the situation to get consistent playing time. I thought I made it clear and if I didn't I apologize that Milwaukee doesn't fit the consistent playing time that I personally think Gross needs. Obviously he's not going to start over Braun, Cameron, or Hart. Again, I tried to specifically put in my post that Milwaukee and playing everyday isn't a good fit. I also wouldn't bash the "supporters" who want him to get consistent playing time because my guess is they're meaning the same thing I am. He'll be more productive playing everyday and that wasn't going to happen in Milwaukee.

 

I'm wondering looking back at it if the Brewers handled Gross' time in Milwaukee the best. Part of me thinks he should've been in AAA to play everyday from day one, but I guess there's no real way to know if that would've mattered.

 

I personally think it's a pretty good trade for the Brewers and Gross. Hopefully it works out for both sides.

[brewers19]

Let's stay calm and civil, folks.

[jjfanec]

I really like Gross and what he brought to the team. I know a lot of people didnt but I thought he worked the count well and had some pop to go along with nice enough speed. However, I don't think he would ever crack the Brewers everyday lineup with Hart, Braun, Cameron, and good outfielders in the minors. I like getting a nice looking pitching prospect for him. I would be interested to see where the minor league guys think Butler would rank in our system.

[TooLiveBrew]

Nice point in #60 from wallus on how confident DM & Co. are in Iribarren.

 

 

I'm not happy at all to see Gross go. You don't find LH bench hitters as good as Gabe very often. I hope Butler pans out in any capacity for us, because as Rluz mentioned, this in no way makes us better for 2008.

[JJHardy7]

A week from today, Gabe Gross or Tony Gwynn were going to see thier chances to get in a game fall off very dramatically, so in my eyes the question becomes which guy brings more to that last guy off the bench, bunt a guy over, late inning relacement role, and I don't think there's any question, its Gwynn.

 

I do think this isn't a bad trade, but I think it's pretty clear you weren't a Gross fan which is fine. My question for you though is can the Brewers rely the rest of the season on a 35 year old outfielder staying healthy all year? If he doesn't stay healthy, I think Gwynn is going to get a ton of playing time. Again it's not a bad trade, but Gross isn't a horrible player and it's not a sure fire bet that Cameron is going to take all the starts away from the 4th or 5th OFer --- there is the possibility a 35 year old OF gets hurt or needs more days off than a younger guy.

[uwisfan]

good trade. Gross was out of options and gone anyways. May as well pick up some pitching potential in the process of dumping a player who was far down the depth chart permanently. Iribarren showed he was a better lefthanded option of the bench if need be. Gwynn and Kapler can hit on par and can field better. Gwynn is younger with more upside. Gross' time was up and in a few years we will have forgotten his name.

[naivin]

That said, the Brewers are short a lefthanded bat now. A lefthanded bat that can take a walk, on a team with an awful OBP, and provide a little bit of power as they now have zero power on the bench from the left side.

 

I know one in Nashville.

 

Yeah. I'm calling for it already. It's time.

 

at first I thought you were talking about Brad Nelson and I rushed off to see how he was doing this year (quite well so far, actually). Then I realized you meant Russ and I couldn't agree more. I hope he sticks around in Nashville till September, I'm sure they'll at least give him a call then, if not before that.

 

This is almost scary. Branyan's who has never proven he deserves the love he gets here, has been gone for a couple years now, and his replacement on this board, has been gone for a couple hours, and already there is a call for Branyan's return. Isn't there any other guys with all this potential they can't seem to find on the field, that half of BF.net can migrate towards? Is it really time to recycle Russ Branyan already?

[TooLiveBrew]

Iribarren showed he was a better lefthanded option of the bench if need be.

 

Absolutely disagree.

 

Gwynn and Kapler can hit on par and can field better.

 

No way you can prove or convince me of this. We lost a lefty bat with very good pop, and a guy that can play all 3 OF spots serviceably. Sure, a year or two from now I might laugh at myself if Butler turns his stuff into success, but for now I think Melvin is gambling on the bench.

 

 

Branyan's who has never proven he deserves the love he gets here, has been gone for a couple years now

 

We get it -- you either loathe or misunderstand OBP & SLG.

[bullox]

Goodbye Greg, ehh, I mean Gabe.

 

Signed,

 

Tom Haudricourt

[wallus]

To the poster who said what do we do if Hart or Braun get hurt, would it be possible that they would bring up LaPorta?

[hawing]

Huh. That'll show me for turning off the computer and going home from work and not immediately tuning in to a media source upon arriving home.

 

Well, Gabe certainly ended his Brewers tenure on a happy note. Good luck to him.

[pitchleague]

quite the shock to hear the XM guys talk about the Brewers win on the car ride home with a post-script of, "Afterward, Gross was traded to Tampa Bay." I nearly slammed the brakes on when I heard it.

 

I wanted Gabe to succeed here but it wasn't meant to be, I guess. I mean, he succeeded here, don't get me wrong, but I thought maybe this would be his place and his time to shine for a full season when we first got him. Just never happened.

 

Oh, well. He was decent in the corner OF spots and shaky in CF, but the guy had a gun for an arm, in my opinion. His eye was pretty good for getting walks. He'll be missed.

 

The Curse of #14 continues for the Brewers, I guess (but I don't count Dave Nilsson completely. He was darn good when healthy.)

[brewizard]

I guess we just had too many Gabes on the team.

[lcbj68c]

It's going to be nice having Gwynn's speed and baseball inteligence back. I'm going to miss Gross's walk up song..."I can only imagine" by Mercy Me...Great song.

 

Good Luck Gross. Oh, how I can't wait till Cameron's back!!!!!!!!!!!

Gross had changed his walk-up song prior to this season to "blessed be the name"