4/13/08 Brewers (Suppan) at Mets (Perez): 12:10 PM CDT

[rluzinski]

I have a huge headache but at least it ended well.

[AJAY]

That was stressful and ugly. I am glad it's over.

 

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b273/AJAY_02/BrewersWin3.gif

 

 

[JJHardy7]

Nice job Brewers players.

 

Nice back handed slap at Yost.

[Marc Newfield of Dreams]

That is a series win over a NL contender. On the road.

 

I'll take it. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

 

*postgame handshakes*

[TooLiveBrew]

Yes..everytime he is right he is lucky and everytime he is wrong it is because he is incompetent.. thanks for the clarification..

 

Thank you for clarifying that you have no understanding of what I posted.

 

...

JJ7, I hear ya, but it's beyond maddening for someone that doesn't like Yost (me) but does his best to be fair about what Ned does or doesn't do, to be lumped in with some mega-group that only cherry-picks on Yost's failures. I've given Yost credit for numerous things he's done in his tenure here.

 

So if Larry K draws up a play for Michael Ruffin to come off a screen and take a 3-pointer with the Bucks down two and 1 second left...and the shot goes in, that's great coaching and the coach should get heaping praise. Cause that's a lot like what Yost just did.

 

Thank you. While it is a bit of a stretch (JJ http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif ), it captures the concept.

A pitcher that should be able to handle in inning and he pitched in a very, very hostile environment based on his history.

 

But Mota was showing every sign of not being able to 'handle' things.

[LaprilOne]

Fire Ned. We won, but he was lucky. He did everything wrong, but he lucked into a win.

 

If he was smart, he would follow the advice here, and used at least nine pitchers.

 

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

Let's get Jim Leyland, he is a genius.

[splitterpfj]

There's no way I would have stayed with Mota in the 8th, and yes, there was a great deal of luck.

 

I also don't care...the good guys won.

[JJHardy7]

So if Larry K draws up a play for Michael Ruffin to come off a screen and take a 3-pointer with the Bucks down two and 1 second left...and the shot goes in, that's great coaching and the coach should get heaping praise. Cause that's a lot like what Yost just did.

 

Thank you. If only others could follow this.

 

It's not the same. Does Ruffin get paid to make 3 pointers or for that matter even shoot? It'd be like expecting Fielder or Braun to be great at bunting. Mota gets paid to be a relief pitcher. That's his job. It's not a fair comparison at all. Yost isn't this horrible manager and he isn't great. The on problem I had with him last year was putting guys in a position to fail. Mota has been around long enough and he wasn't put into a position to fail. If he can't hold a 2 run lead in the 8th, he shouldn't be on the team. Now the bullpen will be well rested come Tuesday and one of the major problems last year was that the bullpen ran out of gas. I'm pretty content as a whole with Yost's work this year and hopefully it continues.

[trwi7]

So if Larry K draws up a play for Michael Ruffin to come off a screen and take a 3-pointer with the Bucks down two and 1 second left...and the shot goes in, that's great coaching and the coach should get heaping praise. Cause that's a lot like what Yost just did.

 

This is the perfect example. When Krystkowiak drew up that play for Ruffin which he bricked off the backboard at the end of the game was a perfect example of terrible coaching whether it works out or not. It didn't go in and it was a terrible play but if Ruffin did actually make it nobody would be singing the praises of Krystkowiak for drawing up that play because there is absolutely no way Ruffin should even be in the game when you only need a basket and not defense.

[TooLiveBrew]

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

See, this is the kind of crap that prevents objective discussion from occuring about Yost. I'll just put it out there right now that I've been able to have many constructive & objective discussions with Yost 'backers', unfortunately all via PM. My guess is that I can/could with JJ7, too, since he at least takes the time to understand what I'm saying.

[Trowekamp]

Yes..everytime he is right he is lucky and everytime he is wrong it is because he is incompetent.. thanks for the clarification..

 

Thank you for clarifying that you have no understanding of what I posted.

 

...

JJ7, I hear ya, but it's beyond maddening for someone that doesn't like Yost (me) but does his best to be fair about what Ned does or doesn't do, to be lumped in with some mega-group that only cherry-picks on Yost's failures. I've given Yost credit for numerous things he's done in his tenure here.

 

So if Larry K draws up a play for Michael Ruffin to come off a screen and take a 3-pointer with the Bucks down two and 1 second left...and the shot goes in, that's great coaching and the coach should get heaping praise. Cause that's a lot like what Yost just did.

 

Thank you. While it is a bit of a stretch (JJ http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif ), it captures the concept.

A pitcher that should be able to handle in inning and he pitched in a very, very hostile environment based on his history.

 

But Mota was showing every sign of not being able to 'handle' things.

You are right I can't find a spec of logic in your argument so I have no ability to follow it. For you to agree with the Bucks comment just confirms that. I think that fact the Yost has buried Turnbow says a lot. Last year he didn't have anyone else. Also his willingness to bring Riske in early in games this years speaks well for him. Mota was the best option there unless you want to burn up Riske with a 1/3 of an inning.

 

Now you could argue Gagne could have came in to finish or if they brought Riske in he could have stayed to pitch the 9th which are valid arguments but otherwise you can't really argue with the logic or the result though you keep trying.

[Trowekamp]

Fire Ned. We won, but he was lucky. He did everything wrong, but he lucked into a win.

 

If he was smart, he would follow the advice here, and used at least nine pitchers.

 

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

Let's get Jim Leyland, he is a genius.

I shudder to think what the message boards would look like if Davey Lopes was managing this team or if we had Dusty Baker running our bullpen.

[strawbossisevil]

I'll admit the situation with Mota was scary, but he got through it. Kudos!

 

It isn't nearly as bad as some seem to indicate. At worst, he fails about 40% of the time in that situation.

 

The basketball comparison is very ridiculous IMO.

 

I do like it that the Yost haters are consistent. Even when the results don't back their point of view.

 

I would say that I understand both points of view. On the one hand, Riske can't pitch in every game, and he just went 2 innings on Friday, on the other hand Mota was in the midst of a rough inning. Since pretty much all we had left in the bullpen for that inning was Turnbow and maybe Riske, its understandable why he stayed with Mota. In many ways, this may have allowed Mota to exercise some demons from his time with the Mets, that has to feel good for him.

[mikerollins]

Great game. Great win.

 

I haven't had a chance to read the in-game thread, but I would assume everyone agrees that today you really gotta give Ned Yost a lot of credit for getting through a game where nobody could throw strikes, but he kept pushing all the right buttons. (Torres for 2 innings, Shouse against the Lefty portion of the lineup, Mota for the 8th). He couldn't have handled the bullpen any better today. Just thought I'd give him a little credit since he takes a lot of heat around these parts.

 

Everyone all together now, "nice job Ned!"

[LaprilOne]

TooLiveBrew wrote:

---

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

See, this is the kind of crap that prevents objective discussion from occuring about Yost. I'll just put it out there right now that I've been able to have many constructive & objective discussions with Yost 'backers', unfortunately all via PM. My guess is that I can/could with JJ7, too, since he at least takes the time to understand what I'm saying.

 

________________________________________

 

Luke, thanks for calling my post crap, I won't do that to you though.

 

Can you not see my point? Go back and read this thread. How many "Ned, wake up," "calling Ned" statements do you see? They are numerous.

 

My case is we have so much instant judgement, couple with, in my view, viscous judgement on Yost. I'll say it again, the bashers consistently say Ned was lucky when things work out, and a fool when they do not.

 

For many here, the man gets no credit for anything positive.

 

At the end of the day, unless we win the world series, Ned will be seen as a failure.

 

Again, thanks for demeaning my post.

[Gobias Industries]

Fire Ned. We won, but he was lucky. He did everything wrong, but he lucked into a win.

 

If he was smart, he would follow the advice here, and used at least nine pitchers.

 

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

Let's get Jim Leyland, he is a genius.

Funny. I'm sure you'd be someone who would be cussin' about Yost for blowing the game if it weren't for Mota getting lucky as hell in that inning. Defend him the next time he does the same thing and it doesn't work.

[LaprilOne]

Fire Ned. We won, but he was lucky. He did everything wrong, but he lucked into a win.

 

If he was smart, he would follow the advice here, and used at least nine pitchers.

 

Remember, we win, Ned is lucky, we loose, he is a moron.

 

Let's get Jim Leyland, he is a genius.

Funny. I'm sure you'd be someone who would be cussin' about Yost for blowing the game if it weren't for Mota getting lucky as hell in that inning. Defend him the next time he does the same thing and it doesn't work.

 

[LaprilOne]

No, Gob, I would be chagrined that Mota did not do the job he was paid to do.

[Gobias Industries]

No, Gob, I would be chagrined that Mota did not do the job he was paid to do.

Yes but Yost still has to do his. Neither did in that 8th inning today.

[trwi7]

No, Gob, I would be chagrined that Mota did not do the job he was paid to do.

 

Well I could hardly get angry at Mota if he didn't do the job he was paid to do because the players he's facing get paid to do a job as well. Ned's job however is to put his players in the best position to succeed. He didn't do that today, he was very lucky Mota got out of that inning.

[samwise]

Good win. If we think our bullpen/staff is in any way shaky, how do the Mets fans feel?

 

With that staff it will be real hard to take first in that division.

[olliegjw]

Wow, this thread is hilarious, considering the Brewers won. According to many here:

 

1. Suppan should have been pulled in the 3rd because he "didn't have it"

2. Torres, Shouse, and Mota all should have been pulled earlier because they "didn't have it"

 

Who would have pitched the last 4 innings today? You have to give Ned credit on getting the victory, when none of his pitchers had any control. It's funny on how when the bullpen does well, the bullpen is great. When the bullpen struggles, it is all Ned's fault for not using them right.

[LaprilOne]

Why is it luck? Why don't we say Mota did his job? Is only not luck if he gets a popup, SO, or week ground ball?

 

Why do you say Ned did not put his player in postion to win? How do we determine that?

[Eddiehitsthefoulpole]

I am a Ned detractor. I thought Ned should have pulled Mota. He didn't, it worked. Mota may be a better pitcher for it in the future. I am going to stick to second-quessing the decisions that go wrong.

[TheBwaz]

If Ned is supposed to know a guy doesn't "have it" after 3 pitches or one batter, how fast are we gonna kill the pen? Mota has a bad batter, bring in the next guy. If he doesn't have it, get another. A little ad infinitum, but not a great way to manage. We would be yanking starters in the 3rd everyday. Thank you, I don't want a Pinella jersey in my dugout.

 

Yes, he does things that drive me nuts and if Ned is floundering in mid June, he should probably face the wrath. If that doesn't turn things around, the Stache may be under the gun; he built the team.