5/20/07 Twins (Ortiz) @ Brewers (Vargas): 1:05 PM CDT

[Vgmastr]

5 of the 6 Brewer runs were driven in by Jenks. He's on fire.

[mikerollins]

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Vargas has been pretty terrible since his second start

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That's a blatant lie. He's been very good his last 3 starts.

[PeaveyFury]

When Jenkins gets hot, he can carry the whole team, and he's certainly doing that today.

 

Hopefully he keeps it up out west.

[Ennder]

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That's simply not true. He's actually been very,very good his last four starts, giving up 0,0,1, and 3 runs respectively

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Thanks for making my point for me.

4 IP, 6 H, 1 BB, 2 K, 1 HR

5 IP, 4H, 5 BB, 5 K

6 IP, 4 H, 3 BB, 4 K

6 IP, 4 H, 2 BB, 4 K, 1 HR

6 IP, 7 H, 1 BB, 2 K, 1 HR

4 IP, 6 H, 6 BB, 1 K, 1 HR

 

31 IP, 31 H, 18 BB, 18 K, 4 HR, 1.58 WHIP

 

Those stats are pretty terrible but people just look at the runs scored and W's so they can't see just how bad he has been. If he pitches like that all year his ERA will be over 5. The only thing keeping the hits down is a good BABIP against and the only thing keeping the runs down is a LOB% that he can't sustain. Unless Vargas makes some adjustments he's going to start getting rocked more and more.

 

4 Hits and 5 BB's in 5 IP is not very good regardless of the fact he let in 0 runs, sometimes the results mean less than how you get there for evaluating a player.

[DougJones43]

Oh no...

[Vgmastr]

For crying out loud Turnbow, throw strikes. A walk to Chris Heintz on four pitches is pathetic.

[mastershake76]

AAAAAAAAAAAAARGH!!!

 

Pull him. Now. zero control. He's done.

[jloos19]

Gotta love how Turnbow can't throw a strike against Chris freakin' Heintz.

[wisconsinfan47]

I'm listening, not watching.

 

Is DBow throwing the breaking ball at all? Or is he just trying to get the fastball over?

[mikerollins]

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Pull him. Now. zero control. He's done.

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I'm glad your not our manager with over-reactions like that to a leadoff walk.

 

Another good outing turned in by Turnbow.

[jjgott]

Great Play by Counsell!

[wisconsinfan47]

Oh man, that's gotta be huge for his confidence.

 

Let's get some insurance!

[DougJones43]

Whew. Glad to see T-Bow straighten up after that leadoff walk...

[PeaveyFury]

but people just look at the runs scored

 

Yeah, how dare they look at the actual results.....

[Vgmastr]

Nice bounce back by Turnbow, but the walk still hurts as Morneau is guaranteed an AB in the 9th.

[Loopee]

Counsell continues to justify using him as a defensive replacement later this year.

[mastershake76]

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I'm glad your not our manager with over-reactions like that to a leadoff walk.

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You and a lot of people. But that goes south for Turnbow more often than it goes well lately.

[DougJones43]

Yeah, how dare they look at the actual results.....

 

With all due respect, he's been getting very lucky this year. Remember that game against the Astros where they loaded the bases against him 3 straight innings without scoring a run? Like Ennder said, there is very little chance he can sustain those results if he keeps giving up all those hits and walks. I think Villanueva is much more likely to give us better production as a starting pitcher over the course of a full season.

[jloos19]

Yeah, how dare they look at the actual results.....

 

This argument will continue for the eternity of brewerfan.net. People such as myself and Ennder want to predict his future performance based on what he has been doing. With a WHIP close to 1.60, there's no way he's going to continue to have an ERA around 3.00, but rather it'll end up around 5.00. Expect more performances like these than a performance where he throws 5 innings, has 5 walks, gives up 5 hits and 0 runs. That just won't happen again.

[Ennder]

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Yeah, how dare they look at the actual results.....

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I do judge them by results, there just are more results to what a pitcher does than earned runs. Pitcher walks 10 guys in 5 IP and lets in 0 runs its not a good game, I don't care about the ER result. Vargas has not thrown the ball well since early April and its starting to worry me and I was a Vargas backer before the season. I don't care about the ER's he's not pitching well.

[PeaveyFury]

Those stats are pretty terrible

 

Actually, no.

 

This was a good start:

6 IP, 7 H, 1 BB, 2 K, 1 HR

 

As was this one:

6 IP, 4 H, 2 BB, 4 K, 1 HR

 

As was this one:

6 IP, 4 H, 3 BB, 4 K

 

So your point that he hasn't been good since the first two starts is blatantly wrong, as 5 out of his 8 starts have been very good, and one of his others was good enough.

[MadisonBrewerBlue]

koo koo for coco puff time

[PeaveyFury]

Remember that game against the Astros where they loaded the bases against him 3 straight innings without scoring a run?

 

That's ONE start of 8. In those last three starts I mentioned, he's had a WHIP of around 1.00, which is great for a pitcher.

 

With all due respect, he's been getting very lucky this year.

 

Fortunately, even after today his end result is better than the guy that we traded for him, who has actually been even more lucky to this point.

[Ennder]

Well we can argue it in the main forum if you'd like, game thread does not seem to be a good place to get into numbers.

 

Come on Cordero, shut it down.

[MadisonBrewerBlue]

take that punto