Designated Yost Thread... Latest: No accountability and lack of urgency (part 1)

[trwi7]

-Riske was being saved for the 10th inning

Wait, he actually said that? That is just classic Ned. Can we fire this idiot and get someone who has a clue?

[brewjihad]

Yes, he did actually say that. Direct quote.

[Roscoe Chill]

If you think this board is angry tonight, imagine the uproar if he would have gone with Gagne in the 9th for the save and Gagne ended up blowing it.

 

Actually, if that would have happened, it just might have been worth it. This board in an uproar? How about Doug Melvin and Mark Attanasio? That just might have got the ball rolling on getting Ned Yost out of here.

[DougJones43]

-Riske was being saved for the 10th inning

Wait, he actually said that? That is just classic.

Exactly. This has happened countless times, where our best options and best players never see the field, because Ned was "saving" them for a situation - that never happened... because the inferior players blew it. Maybe Ned just really appreciates good irony?

[adambr2]

-Riske was being saved for the 10th inning

 

Hmm. I think it would have made more sense to have a chance to get to the 10th or win the game first, then go to our lesser relievers if we failed to take the lead and absolutely had to. That's just me.

 

-Turnbow needed to pitch in a close game to get confidence

 

Right, who cares about what gives the team the best chance to win? Derrick needs to pitch in a close game.

 

-Turnbow also needed to pitch because everyone was tired

 

McClung was on 3 days rest. Torres had pitched 1/3rd of an inning yesterday and had the day off before. Riske hadn't pitched since Friday. The latter 2, at least, were better options than a cold T'Bow who hadn't pitched in a week.

 

-Gagne was going to pitch in a save situation

 

Ah, and Gagne, on his 5th straight day, apparently was not tired, while the above guys were. Maybe McClung, Torres, and Riske need to eat and drink whatever Gagne's having to have all that energy.

 

-Why do we put up with this?

 

Our manager is baffling. Absolutely baffling.

[foster1887]

Was at the game tonight and the minute Turnbow's music started playing, you could hear the boos. Ridiculous if you ask me. Actually surprised me that he didn't allow more runs after the flood of boos when he gave up the run. I'm sorry but if you are having both Turnbow and Riske warming up, I want to see Riske in there. At least that will hopefully allow us to have another inning, if needed, to score a run.

 

But Yost is really start to get me po'ed. What inning was it when it was 0 out with Rickie on 2nd? In that situation, you need to have Hardy bunt. Sure, Rickie ended up scoring on Braun's single but thats not the point. Why not insure a run by having Rickie on 3rd with 1 out than on 2nd with 1 out?

[adambr2]

But Yost is really start to get me po'ed. What inning was it when it was 0 out with Rickie on 2nd? In that situation, you need to have Hardy bunt. Sure, Rickie ended up scoring on Braun's single but thats not the point. Why not insure a run by having Rickie on 3rd with 1 out than on 2nd with 1 out?

 

I actually don't really like the bunt in that situation. Runner on 3rd with 1 out doesn't ensure a run, as we saw in the 8th inning tonight. Braun strikes out or pops up, and suddenly we've given up an out for nothing. In the bottom of the 9th, tie game? Sure, I can see it then.

 

But I think giving outs away is generally a bad idea, especially the way we've been struggling to score runs.

[xisxisxis]

Why not insure a run by having Rickie on 3rd with 1 out than on 2nd with 1 out?

 

The Brewers could have the bases loaded with no outs and a 3-0 count to the batter and not score a run.

[adambr2]

The great part about this is that Yost probably won't trot Gagne out there 4 straight days anymore.

 

This reminds me of a time when I was 13 years old, and I was golfing with a friend. The seventh hole ran along side a country road, which separated the golf course from a field that was surrounded by an electric fence.

 

My buddy and I both yanked our tee-shots off across the road into the field. We were in the very tall grass looking for our golf balls, and we both decided to take a whiz, since we were far from the clubhouse. My friend wondered out loud if the electric fence was on, so we could go over the fence and into the field to retrieve our balls. I suggested that we should just assume it was on, however he thought it would be best to test if the fence was on by "crossing streams" sort of like in Ghostbusters. I opted out of the testing phase, but my friend decided to proceed forward. Long story short, fence was on, golf balls were lost.

 

I'm glad Ned learned not to pee on the fence any more, a better manager probably would have known from the start nothing good would happen by embarking on that endeavor.

 

So much for the idea that Yost won't send Gagne out there for 4 straight days anymore.

 

Is it at all surprising that Yost was at the fence, pants down, ready to pee on the electric fence two nights in a row?

[TooLiveBrew]

The Brewers could have the bases loaded with no outs and a 3-0 count to the batter and not score a run.

As could any team at any level of baseball.

[Blazer25]

The great part about this is that Yost probably won't trot Gagne out there 4 straight days anymore. That's what makes him a good manager. He learns from his mistakes. Case and point is Turnbow not seeing the 8th inning anymore and putting Prince back to the cleanup spot where he feels most comfortable.

This whole quote was supposed to be in blue right Tuesday?

 

Ned does not learn. He had to be asked by his 20-something players to change the lineup otherwise he was going to contiune proving to the world that he was right.

 

All those years as a career back-up have given Ned the world's biggest small man complex. He will stick to his idoitic ideas until some other circumstance forces his hand.

 

He did it with Corey Hart and Mench, he did it with Turnbow, he did it with Brady Clark, he did it with Capuano and you could go on infinitely. He does not learn or refuses to admit his mistakes.

 

World's biggest case of little man syndrome.

[adambr2]

If he runs into it about this often throughout the season

The great part about this is that Yost probably won't trot Gagne out there 4 straight days anymore. That's what makes him a good manager. He learns from his mistakes. Case and point is Turnbow not seeing the 8th inning anymore and putting Prince back to the cleanup spot where he feels most comfortable.

I'm not trying to call you out or anything, I can see where you're coming from. It just almost looks to me like Ned saw your quote and said, "Learn from my mistakes?? Oh yeah?? I'll show him! Gagne goes for the 5th straight day if it's a save situation and Turnbow gets the call if it's tied!"

[Gopher74]

McClung was on 3 days rest.

So what? Are we now saying that because of McClung's last outing we trust him now? That he has passed Turnbow? I don't think so. I'm not going to comment on the other comments, mainly because I didn't hear them, and if he did say that about Riske, then I just don't agree anyway, but it is obvious that the BP was tired.

[jjfanec]

Maybe I am crazy but I am at the point that I would rather have McClung pitch than Turnbow. It is not that I think McClung is good but that I just don't trust Turnbow at all. Turnbow just has no control. He has walked a batter every time he has pitched and has only had one inning this year that two guys didn't get aboard. I know it is an extremely small sample but in five outings (just under 5 innings) he has given 7 hits, walked 6, hit 1 batter, and only stuck out 2. That just isnt the guy to put in in the 9th with the game tied, just to give him some confidence. That is like pinch hitting your worst bench play with a game tied in the bottom of the 9th so he can start feeling better about himself.

[JJHardy7]

Turnbow needed to pitch in a close game to get confidence

 

There comes a point and time where Turnbow is going to have to be counted on or be out of town. Hopefully this pushes the envelope into getting him out of town. If he's on the roster and he has to be counted on whether we like it or not. The main question isn't why did he go in, but why is he on the roster if he doesn't have confidence.

[adambr2]

McClung was on 3 days rest.

So what? Are we now saying that because of McClung's last outing we trust him now? That he has passed Turnbow? I don't think so. I'm not going to comment on the other comments, mainly because I didn't hear them, and if he did say that about Riske, then I just don't agree anyway, but it is obvious that the BP was tired.

I said, in the following sentence, that the LATTER two were better options than Turnbow. (Riske and Torres). I didn't say McClung was a better option or that he had passed Turnbow.

[The Ignitor]

Last year, I did not like Yost and hoped he might be fired. This year, I've seen nothing but solid decisions from Yost (except maybe not having Weeks bunt over the runner in Cincy, but that's nit picking considering the top of the line-up is coming to the plate). Not all decisions work out. No baseball team wins all 162 games, or wins every close game. Even smart baseball decisions look silly when they backfire. Considering how poorly our offense has been, and how bad are last three starters in the rotation have been, any rational, objective outsider would conclude that our manager has done a heck of job with the bullpen to get us the record we have. There was nothing wrong with the decision to use Turnbow last night other than the outcome. And the outcome was not as predictable as some of you make it out to be (go back and do some research on Tbow at home at the start of an inning last year). Given the fact that the team had played extra innings three times in the past four games, Yost was smart to go Tbow (who should have been able to get through the inning unscathed based on history at MP when starting an inning) and set up his pen for later. Besides, in order to not burn out the bullpen down the stretch, sooner or later Tbow is likely going to play a big role in this team unless Melvin is able to trade him (those are the facts, whether you like Yost or not, Tbow is still part of the roster until Melvin says otherwise).

 

You all need to get down from the ledge, as it is a long season, and if you overanalyze every decision you'll be nothing but frustrated for most of the year (pretty much the best team in baseball is guaranteed to lose 60 games even if the manager makes perfect decisions). This team will be around .500 (hopefully a little above) until the end of June, then there schedule will turn in their favor in July and September and they'll pour it on down the stretch. Honestly, what could be better than seeing the Cubs in first place this early in the season? Much better to be the hunter than the hunted, especially if the hunted is the Cubs. I may join you in calling for a change in manager much much later, but right now I'm simply going to enjoy the ride. I encourage you to do the same.

[Fatter than Joey]

Not all decisions work out. No baseball team wins all 162 games, or wins every close game.

 

Really? -- Because every last person here thinks this way.

 

Honestly, what could be better than seeing the Cubs in first place this early in the season?

 

Seeing the Brewers in first place.

 

any rational, objective outsider would conclude that our manager has done a heck of job with the bullpen to get us the record we have.

 

We aren't outsiders. Most of your national types think Ned is on the hot seat.

 

I encourage you to do the same.

 

Pass. I think I am going to jump into a pool with a toaster, and I encourage everyone here to do the same -- The water is warm! or at least it will be shortly...

[jeffy]

But Yost is really start to get me po'ed. What inning was it when it was 0 out with Rickie on 2nd? In that situation, you need to have Hardy bunt. Sure, Rickie ended up scoring on Braun's single but thats not the point. Why not insure a run by having Rickie on 3rd with 1 out than on 2nd with 1 out?

 

I actually don't really like the bunt in that situation. Runner on 3rd with 1 out doesn't ensure a run, as we saw in the 8th inning tonight. Braun strikes out or pops up, and suddenly we've given up an out for nothing. In the bottom of the 9th, tie game? Sure, I can see it then.

 

But I think giving outs away is generally a bad idea, especially the way we've been struggling to score runs.

 

I would be absolutely against bunting in that situation. There are a whole lot of ways the runner can get to third in that situation and there is little chance of a double play, giving a guaranteed out would be dumb (even in the bottom of the 9th). I'm no lover of Yost, but I'd sure rather have him managing than some on here who think a bunt is the way to go any time anyone is on base with less than 2 outs.

 

Bunting the runner to 3rd means you need a fly ball or a hit or some mistake to score him. With the runner on second a hit is still likely to score him and if you don't bunt you have 3 shots at getting the hit...that seems like it should lead to pretty good odds of getting a run. In addition, two fly balls score a run, etc.

 

In addition attempting a bunt does not guarantee success. Might miss or foul off two and be left with only one strike to swing the bat, might pop it up, etc. What is the success rate for bunting?

[Paulus88]

Thought this is as good a place as any but the Cardinals TV crew had a pretty low opinion of Yost and the color guy mentioned that when he talks to 'people who know things' about the Brewers they say that Yost would be lucky to get six weeks into the season before Simmons takes over. I don't really believe that because Yost sure doesn't seem like he is managing for his job and the Cardinals color guy was pretty much a pompous jerk for three hours last night but it is worth mentioning when there is some discussion over the national view of Yost's capability.

[JJHardy7]

Thought this is as good a place as any but the Cardinals TV crew had a pretty low opinion of Yost and the color guy mentioned that when he talks to 'people who know things' about the Brewers they say that Yost would be lucky to get six weeks into the season before Simmons takes over.

 

I was just about to post this. I'm neither anti or pro Yost, but to elaborate a little more the Cards' guy said that the immediate feeling among those that know baseball was that when Simmons was hired he would replace Yost early in the season as the Brewers manager.

[RightFieldCoder]

-Riske was being saved for the 10th inning

Using that logic, Prince should be kept on the bench in case we need him to pitch hit in the 11th.

Bunting the runner to 3rd means you need a fly ball or a hit or some mistake to score him. With the runner on second a hit is still likely to score him and if you don't bunt you have 3 shots at getting the hit...that seems like it should lead to pretty good odds of getting a run. In addition, two fly balls score a run, etc.

Especially when it's your 2, 3, and 4 hitters due up. When Braun doubled, did anyone here hope that Prince would be sac bunting? I hope not.

color guy mentioned that when he talks to 'people who know things' about the Brewers they say that Yost would be lucky to get six weeks into the season before Simmons takes over.

This is what I called for early in the offseason. Keep Yost and let his team get off to the hot start they always do. Then fire him in May or early June before the slide starts.

[Gobias Industries]

Robin19[/b]]This is what I called for early in the offseason. Keep Yost and let his team get off to the hot start they always do. Then fire him in May or early June before the slide starts.

If it weren't for our suprisingly good defense and pitching so far, the slide would already be in effect. It seems like 2 guys are carrying the team for entire series while the other 6 take the series off. It's amazing where our record is.

 

I have no problem with how Yost used Turnbow last nite. We all know the stats show Turnbow is really good starting off an inning when it's not consecutive days. Turnbow just didn't throw his breaking ball for strikes and hitters can tee off on his fastball no matter how fast it is. You'd think there is a chance his days are numbered here.

 

Going with Gagne in a save situation would have borderline insane last nite though. The crowd would have went ballistic if he came out again. Sending him out there for the 5th consecutive day would have been as good a reason as any to fire him.

[Greg Vaughn]

Yost scans 25 man roster which consists of a record 14 pitchers and says "this looks like a great spot to get turbow some work".

 

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

?????????????????????????????????????????????

 

 

(broke long string of ?? -1992)

[Greg Vaughn]

Seriously.....Yost has reached the point of "indefensible". That was not the place to put Turnbow in......period. Warming up Gagne for the Ninth if necessary......my god.

 

He is just plain dumb.....he's not a smart man. I'd like to have someone try to combat that statement.