How to keep Parra at 170 innings or less

[logan82]

He wouldn't have any innings left for the playoffs if he has 170 during the season.

 

You can limit a guy's innings in AAA pretty easy. They can pitch guys any way they want in AAA. Turnbow is starting down there.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I'm not sure we'd need Parra in our playoff rotation as it is. It seems that a deal for an SP is going to happen so we could just do Sheets, Sabathia, Suppan, and then give Bush or McClung Game 4 if we don't want to pitch Sheets on 3 days rest. Parra could start Game 4 as well if he's got anything left in the tank.

[logan82]

In my mind right now it is a toss up between Parra and Suppan for the third spot in a playoff rotation. I would probably lean towards Suppan. I would prefer Parra over Bush by a little and no way do I want to see McClung pitch in the playoffs. If Parra keeps up his current rate he will be out of innings and into the danger zone before the playoffs. I wouldn't count his innings so far as "typical" either. He has had a lot of short outings with high pitch counts so I think his innings so far have been more stressful than typical innings.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

If Parra would get into an "Innings Limit" situation, the C.C. signing does wonders here. We now have options to keep Parra's innings down and maybe save him for the playoff run by skipping his start a few times here and there.

[Patrick425]

He wouldn't have any innings left for the playoffs if he has 170 during the season.

I guess I'm just a little "old school" (sorry for using that very overused phrase), but these discussions about innings limits just kills me. I understand the desire not to overwork a rookie pitcher or young pitcher with little ML experience. However, do we need to put a hard number on it? Some of you act like his arm will fall off if he goes one pitch over 170 innings. Does he have some sort of microchip in his arm that counts the number of innings he throws and after that he just shuts down?

 

I would be willing to take the bet that if he pitches another 20 or 30 innings in the postseason (after 170 innings) it will not effect the rest of his career in the least.

 

Cut to Warren Spahn spinning in his grave as he reads this thread.

[JohnBriggs12]

I agree with Patrick. Using the Sabathia acquisition as a way to limit Parra's innings is counterproductive. You want Sabathia replacing the 5th best pitcher, not the 2nd. Parra is 25 going on 26. He's not a kid. He's 4 years removed from his surgery. You limit innings for 20 and 21 year olds, not guys approaching their prime ages.

 

He should be strong enough for 190-200 innings.

[TooLiveBrew]

You may want him to be that strong, but the fact is that he's never thrown 140 IP in his career, and the most he's done since 2004 is roughly 135 IP.

 

I know it's frustrating that the game has changed from how it used to be, but to pretend that working Parra up over 170 IP this year isn't a huge risk just isn't objective imo.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I agree with Patrick. Using the Sabathia acquisition as a way to limit Parra's innings is counterproductive.

Will you be saying the same thing if Parra gets hurt? With Parra's injury history, that idea is very much in play.

[Glennron]

I wouldn't mind if they skipped one of Parra's starts every once in a while in favor of Bush/McClung/Suppan (whoever goes to the 'pen). That way, if/when (please God) they make the playoffs they wouldn't have to worry as much about his innings total.

 

(edit: AOL-speak --1992)

[Oldcity]

Parra has never thrown more than 139 innings in a season, and that was a few years ago. I'm not comfortable at all with him going more than 170, and I'd prefer it to be less. The Brewers should get creative with him in the second half.

[Patrick425]

What is all this weight training and carefully planned out conditioning and throwing between starts that today's pitchers go though all about? Why is 170 such a magic number?

 

I still think today's pitchers are way too pampered.

[kramnoj]

Skimming through the Brewers schedule, they have 3 days off within the span of a week Aug 21st -28th. Depending on the condition of the rotation, the standings, etc, that seems like a time where Parra could be skipped one or two starts if the IP is a concern.

[TooLiveBrew]

Imoh it's not that 170 is a magic number. It's that it's a ballpark estimate for the upper range of what his shoulder might be able to handle. In general, I agree with you on the pitchers, but due to expansion & the power/'roids evolution of the game, you have to protected the few talented arms you do have, sadly.

[bullox]

I still think today's pitchers are way too pampered.

Tell that to JM Gold, Nick Neugebauer, Mike Jones, Mark Rogers, etc etc etc

 

[kramnoj]

170 isn't a magic number for all pitchers. It is the majic number for Parra this year, if you follow the theory that developing pitchers should only add about 30 IP per season until they get to a full starting load. There's no proof that it works, but it is a good idea to make sure that pitchers don't get shredded while they are developing. Parra's history has prevented him from following what would be considered a normal workload.

 

I think the best plan this year is not to worry about actual IP, just focus on Parra and how he is pitching. As long as he is pitching strong, he is fine. But yank him if he is really struggling and keep his arm fresh.

[RSteadman19]

Well according to the Brewers website the probable pitchers for the week are: McClung-today, CC-tomorrow, Sheets-Wed, Bush-Thur, and Suppan for Friday. So something is up, either they are pushing him back to Sat. or they are skipping him altogether, becasue we know that CC is going again on Sunday. But ESPN has a totally different lineup of pitchers with Parra getting pushed into the Wed game and everyone else sliding back a day, so who knows what is going on?

[1992casey]

The Brewers should get creative with him in the second half.

 

It seems that he'll only have one more start before the All Star break. Without the Sabathia acquisition, he could have easily been pitching both tomorrow and Sunday.

 

After the break, he could be lined up as the fifth guy out of the gate. Then there are the days off in late August that could afford him some rest.

 

This could still be inadequate, but it'd a reasonable way to approach the innings issue without disrupting things or missing him much.

[fondybrewfan]

Well according to the Brewers website the probable pitchers for the week are: McClung-today, CC-tomorrow, Sheets-Wed, Bush-Thur, and Suppan for Friday. So something is up, either they are pushing him back to Sat. or they are skipping him altogether, becasue we know that CC is going again on Sunday. But ESPN has a totally different lineup of pitchers with Parra getting pushed into the Wed game and everyone else sliding back a day, so who knows what is going on?

Now that Suppan is on the DL it looks like it will be Parra on Friday, McClung on Saturday, and CC on Sunday. So the CC pickup is keeping one start from Manny, I guess any little bit helps

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I thought it was interesting that Parra pitched a scoreless 8th inning out of the pen yesterday. That's a good use of a player who needed some work after getting his start skipped. Another good move by Ned Yost.

[Thurston Fluff]

I wouldn't be that surprised if they gave Villanueva a spot start or two both to keep Parra's innings down and see if Villy has straightened himself out enough to be considered for starting in the future.

[PrimeTime955]

I wonder if they would consider piggy-backing Parra and Carlos for 3-4 innings each for a month or so. Parra as we know has been solid lately and Carlos has been pretty darn good out of the pen if he only has to see hitters once or twice.

[Tbadder]

I'm afraid the the Brewers are going to forget to limit his innings because of the wild card race. They absolutely have to have this guy for years and can't afford to make a mistake. I'd be seriously tempted to put Manny in the pen until August 1st. I realize this would be very unpopular, and probably won't stand up to scrutiny, but I think Manny's health is that important.

[Roscoe Chill]

August 1st? Why? So they can have him in 2011 when they have a nice team and they decide to rest Jeremy Jeffress the same?

 

I understand the innings issue, but a lot of you guys thought that Gallardo was getting shut down last year...didn't happen. Remember, the Brewers are "going for it." Parra is a big part of "it."

 

They also announced that Parra is #3 out of the gate after the All Star Break, as it should be.

 

Again, I understand the concern, but I think people around here are way more concerned than the Brewers brass actually will be in the middle of a pennant race.

[And That]

I understand the innings issue, but a lot of you guys thought that Gallardo was getting shut down last year...didn't happen.

Gallardo pitched 188 innings last year, 160 (give or take a few innings, I forgot how long his playoff start was) in '06. And Gallardo was taken out of the rotation at one point - he didn't make a start from June 29th to July 19th. No one that I can remember suggested "shutting him down" last year and that's not being suggested this year for Parra. Parra just needs to be kept under 170 innings. It is certainly possible to do that and be a contending baseball club at the same time.

Sheets and Sabathia could well be gone after the year. If Parra were to get hurt because he got pushed to hard, we might not have him either.

 

We need Manny Parra in 2008 and 2009 and 2010 and 2011 and 2012.

 

[logan82]

August 1st? Why? So they can have him in 2011 when they have a nice team and they decide to rest Jeremy Jeffress the same?

By 2011 Jeffress should be worked up to 200+ innings before he is in the MLB rotation.