Claudio Vargas released

[rluzinski]

If you ballpark the 2008 payroll at $80 million the $900k is just over 1 percent of the payroll.

 

$2.9 mil is only 3% but it was enough o motivate Melvin to release Vargas.

[jimmyjeromehardy7]

Parra and Villenueva and possibly bush would have actually brought us back a nice , decent posion player two months ago.

That's okay I am good with our position players. I think we are solid all around the diamond.

[logan82]

southpaw121505 wrote:

DVR bro, DVR http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

Yeah I have TiVo, but I am not always at home when I grill. I love TiVo, it felt like a holiday yesterday when I came home to find that my TiVo had recorded a preseason Brewers game. My TiVo gets me.

[don1481]

Nothing against Claudio the person but... I did a dance in my cubicle when I found out this news today at work. I do agree with the comments above about Vargas being an insurance policy "just in case" something else were to have happened. That does make sense. That plus you never know when you could have traded him. It was a calculated risk by Melvin but as much as I dislike Claudio the pitcher, one that needed to be made.

 

Now let's say no one signs Claudio. Could the Brewers offer him a minor league deal to give them depth? Would he take that offer?

[DHonks]

I was thrilled to hear this move today. Claudio is a 5th starter. As of now, we have 5 healthy starters that are better than him, and one nearing full health. I'd like to see us add some depth, but with an offense scoring 5-6 runs per game, it isn't a huge concern

[thebruce44]

It's more like 5 1/2 pitchers. Sheets doesn't count as 1, either.

 

Vargas only pitched 134 innings last year people, so he doesn't exactly count as a full pitcher either.

 

His career ERA is around 5.00 and his VORP last year was 8.6 (less than a win above replacement level). I would hope that should an injury occur we could call up any number of AAA players or make a trade to get similar production for a fraction of the cost.

[LouisEly]

*Yawn*

 

Oh... did something happen? Are Narverson and Z-Jack still in the organization? Yes? Has the season started yet? No? Still got time to make some deals? Yes? OK, good... back to bed.

[RightFieldCoder]

I wasn't trying to imply that trading for Mota was a good deal. I was just pointing out that between the two, on March 25th, Vargas is the odd man out. I agree that we would have been better served non-tendering Estrada and cutting Vargas.

 

It's a long offseason when letting go of a barely above replacement player causes 5 pages in one day. I can't wait for Saturday. (My first chance to see them this year)

[Team Canada]

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rluzinski wrote:

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If you ballpark the 2008 payroll at $80 million the $900k is just over 1 percent of the payroll.

 

$2.9 mil is only 3% but it was enough o motivate Melvin to release Vargas.

 

Assuming you don't buy DM's stated reason that Vargas was at the bottom of the ranking they did, which is entirely possible.

 

In either case, I agree that the DM got completely hosed on the DD trade.

 

[Baldkin]

I would consider it a wash, all things considered (I mean, Estrada wasn't that bad last year - especially the first half of the season... who else would've caught for the 'crew?)... I would consider the Brewers having come out on top had Greg Aquino never pitched for the MLB team.

[aracko]

I might be Vargas biggest supporter around. I guess I understand the move though. Parra is only good for probably 170 innings or so. I think thats good enough out of your 4th starter. Even as a big fan of Vargas, I cant justify keeping Parra or Carlos out of the rotation so that you can keep Vargas in. Villaneueva should Max out at about 150 Innings. Thats more than Vargas gives us and the upside cant come close.

 

Does Bush stay as the long guy? The Crew has come a long way when Vargas is no longer good enough for this team.

[endaround]

Nope Bush needs to stay in the rotation because they need his innings. And Vargas is still better than McClung if they need three innings. I just really hope that we don't get back to back weather delays in Chicago.

[twobrewers]

In either case, I agree that the DM got completely hosed on the DD trade.

M'eh. Unless Eveland turns into something with the A's - I am still not losing sleep.

 

I would like to think that Davis, Eveland and Krynzel could have gotten us something better. Just like I would like to think Vargas could have gotten us anything right now. Maybe there wasn't much interest in any of those players?

 

Either way, we are a better team now than if we had kept Davis, Eveland and Krynzel. So it still worked out.

[endaround]

How are the Brewers a better team? Davis at least would have brought more draft picks. Eveland would have provided great depth at AAA. And thats is they weren't traded for players that would have provided value. The Brewers gave up the most talented player and the player with the greatest upside. Those trades are almost always terrible ideas.

[JJHardy7]

Nope Bush needs to stay in the rotation because they need his innings. And Vargas is still better than McClung if they need three innings. I just really hope that we don't get back to back weather delays in Chicago.

Do all moves need to take into account a couple of April games? It's really not going to matter after McClung is put on waivers in April.

[homer]

I'd rather have Vargas than McClung in long relief. That is all.

[endaround]

Nope Bush needs to stay in the rotation because they need his innings. And Vargas is still better than McClung if they need three innings. I just really hope that we don't get back to back weather delays in Chicago.

Do all moves need to take into account a couple of April games? It's really not going to matter after McClung is put on waivers in April.

Well given that April is when you tend to have the most bad weather, yes. Especially games against the Cubs which, yes are more important. And its no sure thing McClung will be gone in 2 weeks.

 

[aracko]

In either case, I agree that the DM got completely hosed on the DD trade.

M'eh. Unless Eveland turns into something with the A's - I am still not losing sleep.

 

Eveland has been pretty dominating over there for Oakland and has been named #4 starter.

[Thurston Fluff]

The brewers could have traded one of their surplus starters 3 months ago, and gotten something, but we elected to stand pat and ask for too much in return.

It appears Vargas had no trade value. Trading Cappy would have meant everything would have had to work out as it did or the rotation would have been weaker than it is. If Cappy stayed healthy and pitched to his norm and Parra or Villy were not as good as they appear we would have been covered. Given the status of all the postion players that has as much value as any guy Cappy alone could get. All Cappy could have got us is another average pitcher to compete in an already overcrowded field of average pitchers. What good is that? If we had traded Bush then it turns out our starting rotation would have been weaker. Unless we traded for another Bush type pitcher. But why trade Bush or Cappy for Bush or Cappy type pitchers?

After thinking about this over night I guess we should look at this as a good sign. The Brewers are now good enough to cut actual major league caliber players simply because they weren't good enough to make the team. Perhaps we'll have to get used to this as the team gets better.

[RobertR]

Where's this confidence in Narveson coming from? Because he was good in some meaningless spring training games?

 

I think people are underestimating just how bad some of these replacement pitchers can be and how damaging they can be to teams. It's not uncommon for replacements to come up and post ERAs of 6 or 7. I mean, yeah, it's hard to get really upset over Claudio Vargas but you know what you're getting out of him, 6 slow innings of about 5 ERA-ish per start. We don't know if Narveson or Jackson can even manage that.

 

Robert

[JJHardy7]

Well given that April is when you tend to have the most bad weather, yes. Especially games against the Cubs which, yes are more important. And its no sure thing McClung will be gone in 2 weeks.

 

I guess I just have a different opinion then. I'd rather see the Brewers put together the best roster for the long haul and we won't know until the end of the year how important the Cubs games were.

[brewjihad]

I'd rather have Vargas than McClung in long relief. That is all.

I think we all agree, but that might not have been an option. Doug + Ned, to their credit, determined that Vargas was not good enough to be in the rotation. And (speculation alert) he might have told them he didn't want to go to the pen and would rather be traded. Otherwise, they might have just realized that $3 million is plenty to pay a long reliever.

 

I'd rather have Vargas than McClung as well, but it's possible that Vargas wasn't even an option as a reliever.

[jimmyjeromehardy7]

Where's this confidence in Narveson coming from? Because he was good in some meaningless spring training games?

Are these the same meaningless ST games that had everyone panicking when the ERA's were north of 9 a few weeks ago. I think he proved he can pitch as good or better than Vargas over said games.

 

The Brewers are a better team now and we need to get over the fact that decent players will be cut. Vargas was the 7th starter when Yo comes back. Unless we plan to go with a 7 man rotation (and I doubt even Yost would consider that) there wasn't room for him. I wish him luck but its not like he is going to win the Cy Young any time soon. 7th starters are replacable.

[joepepsi]

I mean, yeah, it's hard to get really upset over Claudio Vargas but you know what you're getting out of him, 6 slow innings of about 5 ERA-ish per start. We don't know if Narveson or Jackson can even manage that.

Well ZachJack did make 7 starts in 2006, averaging 5-1/3 innings per start, 5.54 ERA. I realize that's a small sample size but it's in Vargas territory. And Zach is 5 years younger and cheaper. He might actually get better.

 

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Instead, he has at least two guys with less value in the pen (Mota and McClung)

I think Mota will be a good reliever for us and would have more value there than Vargas would in the pen. McClung has a history of being a starter for the DRays and he pitched well in multiple inning appearances this Spring. We really aren't that bad off without Vargas.