Capuano DL'd : Torn ligament in left elbow (reply #88); no surgery FOR NOW-try 3-4 weeks of rehab (reply #161); Tommy John surgery Thurs., May 16th (reply #192)

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Yeah I don't know what to believe when Suppan says he's just working on his pitches as his first priority and not getting people out. Is that a decent excuse for an 11 ERA in spring? I guess we'll find out.

[TooLiveBrew]

Every established MLB pitcher works almost exclusively on their pitches in ST - not getting guys out. That's not a new thing, either.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I know it's not a new thing, but is it an excuse for an 11 ERA?

[jackalope02ca]

I couldn't care less if a veteran has an 11 or 21 ERA in spring training. it has no relevance. If they are working on pitches that's great. What I like to see if a solid last start spring training prior to the start of the season where they work at least 5 innings. Prior to that the numbers don't mean much for a veteran. They treat spring training differently than someone trying to make the team.

[TauPentaRei]

Remember this game?

Johnny Estrada hit a grounder to first baseman Conine, who initiated an easy 3-2-3 double play.

 

Kevin Mench popped out.

thankfully no I don't. but lord have mercy! talk about addition through subtraction. That I will never have to witness / hear / read about the antics of those 2 again is almost as refreshing as holding my tickets to game 2 at Doublemint Field.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Prior to that the numbers don't mean much for a veteran. They treat spring training differently than someone trying to make the team.

I don't think Cappy was treating Spring Training like this and he still did horrible. Not a good sign unless if it truly was his sore elbow as the culprit.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Every established MLB pitcher works almost exclusively on their pitches in ST - not getting guys out. That's not a new thing, either.

Well, hopefully all the hard work Suppan's been putting in actually makes his pitches less hittable. I don't know if it's "working on pitches" as much as it is that veteran pitchers not in a roster battle don't give a crap about spring training, as long as they avoid injuries...I'm thinking that to this point in spring training, Suppan's probably more worried about his golf handicap than his ERA.

 

It does get very annoying to listen to postgame comments from Yost, talking about how "close he is to being really good"....hopefully he proves to be a prophet, because there are pitchers/hitters all over the place who are "close" - they're called bad mlb pitchers/hitters.

[TooLiveBrew]

I know it's not a new thing, but is it an excuse for an 11 ERA?

 

Absolutely.

[brewmann04]

suppan better get himself straighten out or he could be dropped from the 3rd dpot to the 5th spot.

[JohnBriggs12]

We pretty much know what Suppan is no matter what he does this spring. His pitching line on any given day goes: 6 IP, 8H, 3ER, 1 BB, 3 K. He'll do that, give or take a run or an inning, roughly 27 of his 33 starts.

 

Of the other 6 starts, 3 will be really bad (5 runs or more), and 3 will be really good (1 or fewer runs).

 

That's okay for a 4th starter, and better than average for 5th starter. The problem is he's being paid as the number 2 starter, and if they go with any or all of Vargas, Bush, and Capuano, they are getting no better than an average number 4 starter from any starter not named Sheets or Gallardo. Given the fragility of Sheets, that's not a good thing.

[TooLiveBrew]

The problem is he's being paid as the number 2 starter

 

But that's not really the case anymore. The salaries have just escalated so much - plus, given that, his 2008 contract number ($8 mil.) isn't even close to being #2 money - it's 2009 & 2010 where you see that big jump (Soup pulled in $6 mil. for 2007).

 

I think JBriggs's summary on Suppan is pretty much spot-on, fwiw.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I know it's not a new thing, but is it an excuse for an 11 ERA?

Absolutely.

I hope you're right. How did Suppan do last Spring?

[DrWood]

I know it's not a new thing, but is it an excuse for an 11 ERA?

 

Absolutely.

I hope you're right. How did Suppan do last Spring?

I looked at his recent springs for MIL and STL and his ERAs were between 3.5 and 6.9. No 11.

 

[jazzytrav]

Is there really much of a difference between 6.9 and 11?

[SoCalBrewfan]

All this talk about 11. Why don't you just make 10 louder, and make that the largest number?

 

Honestly, stats shouldn't be published for the month of April, much less spring training. The level of competition and effort in spring games is so uneven that it's almost a sheer coincidence if any of those numbers mirror full-season values. It's almost as pointless as noting that some hitter is 4 for his last 18...it's just noise to fill up otherwise dead air (or ink for filling otherwise blank sports pages). Suppan has a track record, as noted above, and his performance is more predictable than that of almost anyone on the team...until and unless he gets hurt or just loses it due to old age...and I'd trust a scout or pitching coach to spot that before relying on spring training statistics.

 

I do think that it's very much not nice and not classy to wish for anyone to be injured.

[TooLiveBrew]

All this talk about 11. Why don't you just make 10 louder, and make that the largest number?

 

But Suppan goes to 11. *chews gum*

 

Isn't it relatively clear that when a pitcher is just throwing one or two of his pitches, MLB-caliber (& just below) guys can hit him? I honestly don't mean that in a mean-spirited way. I'm not sure why there's confusion/worry.

[AJAY]

From Tom Haudricourt's blog. . . .

 

Villanueva certainly doesn't deserve to go to the minors. He is a big-league pitcher and on talent alone should be in the rotation. But somebody has to go and Yost has made it clear that Villanueva is considered a starter now, not a reliever. And you almost get the feeling that Villanueva sees it coming when you talk to him.

 

 

 

(On a personal note, my blood pressure went up when I read this. I swear to god, I really really hate Ned Yost. I just can not stand him. How can you even think about not having Villanueva in the Brewers rotation? Send Ned to the minors instead. Or better yet, designate him for assignment.)

[And That]

I don't have a problem with dropping Villanueva to AAA to start the year. I've always been sort of leery of CV's upside. If he dominates AAA, great, bring him back up. If not, leave him down there until you need him. It won't be the end of the world.

 

I really think it's gonna be Sheets/Suppan/Parra/Vargas/Bush to begin the year with Gallardo pushing Bush out of the rotation until Parra goes to the pen in June to reduce his innings.

[TheBrewer]

I will be soooooooooo peeved too if Villaneuva starts the year in the minors or goes to the Minors. He seriously has nothing left to prove, and can only offer upside. He will certainly have a reason to be p****** off as I would too.

 

My Dream of the Rotation:

1. Sheets

2. Gallardo / Bush

3. Suppan

4. Villanueva

5. Bush / Parra

 

I figure have Bush in the rotation until Gallardo comes back which should be soon, then drop him to the #5 starter. Bush is an inning eater and always is healthy for the most part and could potentially offer upside.

 

I seriously can't stand how Yost says that ST will determine who goes where, but then he says performance from the seasons past like the vets is big, but then Vargas is doing great in ST, so now he could potentially be in the rotation.

 

Trade Cappy, trade Vargas, keep Bush as the long man inning eater, #5 starter or something along those lines.

 

 

Unfortuantly Yost runs the Club so the rotation will look like this:

1. Sheets

2. Gallardo / Bush

3. Suppan

4. Vargas

5. Bush / Capuano - if Cappy is not healthy then Parra

 

So will have 2 young players who have a ton of POTENTIAL upside in Parra and Villanueva sitting in the minors, while just because Cappy, Vargas, Bush etc are vets, even though they have pitched poorly in the past will get into the rotation.

 

Wow, aside from Gallardo which yes is a big imrpovement over a full season, our rotation will still be the same. Mediocre at the end of it.

[Ennder]

Spring training isn't over you know... the starters are getting stretched out and Suppan will probably have two starts of 5 innings to bring down his ERA. Cole Hamels had a 10 ERA going into his last start too, he dropped it to a 6 or so. This really isn't a big deal at all. Suppan will be the same as always, a mediocre guy who relies on defense to help him out because he doesn't strike out enough guys.

[Thurston Fluff]

When it comes to spring stats one thing that gets overlooked is nobody worrys about scouting reports or review of the up coming team. The pitchers work on their stuff regardelss of what type of hitter they are facing. So if Soup wants to work on his fastball he's more concerned with that than the fact that he's throwing fastballs to a fastball hitter. I'd suspect guys like Soup who rely on those tpye of things more than pure stuff would have a harder time putting up good numbers in spring than someone like Sheets who can throw a fastball past a fastball hitter.

 

(On a personal note, my blood pressure went up when I read this. I swear to god, I really really hate Ned Yost. I just can not stand him. How can you even think about not having Villanueva in the Brewers rotation? Send Ned to the minors instead. Or better yet, designate him for assignment.)

 

There is this guy called Doug Melvin. His job title suggests he is the one who has final say. At this point in spring I think there will be a lot of things said by both Melvin and Yost that should be taken with a grain of salt. Nothing is set and both of them have mentioned possibilities that seem to be taken as probabilities.

[chuckiehacks]

well, the good news is they just justified a AAA rehab stint for Capuano, without worrying about any teams claiming him.

And its for this reason that I'd be surprised if this injury was "real."

 

I've heard from a fairly reliable source that this is the case. Whether its coming from Cappy or the team, I don't know.

[TauPentaRei]

"...Left-handed pitcher Chris Capuano had a MRI this morning on his left elbow... The team is calling it soreness and inflammation..."

 

Really? Oh that's nice. The team.

 

How subjective are MRIs? My previous impression was that they are quite conclusive.

 

Usually the results of an MRI start with either "Player X was given good news when..." or "the MRI discovered a FILL-IN-THE-BLANK, doctors are prescribing a course of action..."

 

What's with the half-information?

 

edit:

I'm on board Chuckie. This stinks sumpin fishy. My own guess is that it has to do with insurance policy / $ recovery haggling.

[Ennder]

I dunno, the first time Garciaparra had an MRI on his wrist it was just bruised and the second time he had one it found a microfracture. Hafner had the same thing with his hand injury. Seems like MRI are always giving incorrect results or it is just commonplace for teams to lie about them.

[Fear The Chorizo]

maybe MRI stands for Make-up Reporters' Information.